"You cannot legislate morality"

[Dale Cozby]

Ok this is a phrase most of us have heard over the years.

Is this statement true or false? and why?

I would put forth the thesis that ALL laws are based on some form of morality.
Legislating it and making people moral are NOT the same thing.
Does morality laws influence people to behave morally even if they are not moral and should government try to change people behavior to be more moral?

Here are some examples of legislation of morality in our western society to chew on:

Abolition of slavery
Prohibition
Abortion
Obscenity/public nudity laws
Anti-drug laws
Civil-rights
HateSpeech/HateCrimes
DUI/DWI public intoxication laws
Spousal abuse/child abuse laws
Smoking bans

[Hans Deventer]

Ok this is a phrase most of us have heard over the years.

Is this statement true or false? and why?

It is true in this respect that laws don't change a person. Paul makes quite an issue out of that in his letter to the Romans.

Having said that, it is still a lot better to have good laws than bad ones or none. And Paul also said that the Torah is "holy and good".

[Mark Doble]

During my days long ago of rowdiness I remember the morality police coming around. As soon as they left things returned to as they were... Making a law does nothing to change one,s heart... Only Christ can do that.

I believe one's morals and values comes from their way of upbringing and within their heart. Their dedication and resolve in their relationship with God dictates how far they will deviate from that path.

[Barbara Moulton]

I believe one's morals and values comes from their way of upbringing and within their heart. Their dedication and resolve in their relationship with God dictates how far they will deviate from that path.

You are right Mark. And this got me thinking.

It is true that legislation can't change the hearts of people. However, consistent legislation based on moral principles does seem to help a society to behave more morally. So if people are raised observing those behaviours will the be moral? If part of their upbringing is living in a society which condemns racism, for example, and has laws against discrimination, will they then have stronger morals about racism?

If I am raised in a society which condones and practices slavery, I might not see the moral wrong of slavery.

But for those of us raised in North America in the last 100 years or so, I imagine we all view slavery as morally reprehensible.

[Cecil Wallace]

Why do we have laws anyway?
In the area of criminal and civil law, aren't most laws reactive to some situation? The law is an attempt to correct that problem.
Generally speaking, why create a law unless there a need for it?

In the spiritual area, why the 10 commandments?
Why "Thou shalt not kill" unless there had been killing?

Same goes for the other 9 commandments, I would think.

So, "legislating" morality is the attempt to try to "straighten" people out, when, as has been stated elsewhere in this thread, that "straightening out" must come from within, and that as a person surrenders to the Lord.

Just my two cents worth.

[Dale Cozby]

I just got back from watching Amazing Grace when I started this thread.
It is the story of William Wilburforce and his struggle for abolition in the British empire. In a time when few except the "radically religious" were abolitionists.

Today the vast majority of people are abolitionists. So...a moral of the society at large was changed.

I could cite other examples both successes and failures in trying to change the moral fiber of a society through legislation.

The word says that :We know that the law is good if one uses it properly. We also know that law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious; for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, for adulterers and perverts, for slave traders and liars and perjurers—and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine.

The law instills fear, fear of punishment. BUT, We also know that those who don't break the law have nothing to fear from it.

So to avoid that fear people behave in moral ways. The fewer laws a society has the more immoarl it will become. As those who are wicked and unrighteous will have no fear where there is no law.

"for before the law was given, sin was in the world. But sin is not taken into account when there is no law....The law was added so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more,"

So does law move people closer to God or farther away? or does it have no effect?

[Jim Franklin]

When I taught American Government at BNC I often suggested that all laws can be traced directly or indirectly to the Ten Commandments. The laws you identify help establish order in society and that is a major reason for the existence of governments. Anarchy is the absence of order and each person a government onto themselves. The more our society accepts immoral behavior the closer it comes to anarchy.