Purity Pledge...

[Wesley Smith]

[SIZE="4"]The situation at Gig Harbor has had a significant impact upon my life and ministry. In short...I am convinced that one good thing that could emerge from that dramatic failure is if pastors and churches would become proactive re. the moral purity issue. These tragedies come and go and we pastors and leaders tend to hunker down and hope for as little collateral damage as possible.

This Sunday morning in my Pentecost Message, I am going to read the following "Purity Pledge" when I come to the point about...tongues of fire:

Purity Pledge:

Pastoral calling is a gift from Almighty God.

My confession:

I know this calling rests on the condition of the thoughts of my mind which flow from my spirit, my relationship with God.

Today I hold in my hand the visible symbol of my pastoral calling, my ordination. Thirty-two years ago in Sacramento, CA, Dr. Edward Lawlor placed his hands on my head and commissioned me to be an ordained pastor.

That ordination was presented in the context of moral purity.

It is with humility and with sanctified pride in the grace of God that I proclaim today that moral purity has been treasured and maintained in my life for all the years of my ministry. Colleen has been, and is, my one and only.

My Charge:

My charge to the congregation today is for you all to treasure moral purity—mine, the purity of the staff, and, the purity of entire congregation.

Be bold! Call me to be accountable if you see anything morally suggestive or questionable in my life. I give you permission to confront me, as I will in turn likewise confront you.

My Pledge:

I love you all and one thing this means is that I am fully accountable to God, to my General and District Leaders, to the Staff, to the Church Board, and, to the entire Congregation. My pledge to you all is that I will do whatever is necessary to maintain moral purity.


[NazNetters...help! This is my clumsy attempt to open dialogue in my congregation and to possibly get a positive moral movement started. Help me improve this pledge and make it something Pastors and Staff Members can present to the Congregation on an annual basis. Feel free to tweak the document and use it in your own situation. Just let me know of any improvements you make! I believe this, or whatever it evolves into, could raise the tide of moral purity IN the Church and address the skepticism OUTSIDE the Church. My reason for presenting it on Pentecost Sunday has some to do with thoughts I've had about a "Purity Sunday" that seem to coincide.

It is with fear and trembling and super anticipation that I hit the "Submit New Thread Button!]

Friend,

Wes

[Jim Franklin]

At our assembly yesterday a young man presented an invitation to be part of a conference on the church's need for moral purity. He is starting an organization designed to go all over presenting the case for moral purity. He had 3/4 of the congregation stand and said that according to statistics he has that that high of percentage of church constituents have been adversely affected by sexual abuse or pornography of other acts of moral impurity. Then he had one section sit down leaving about half of the assembly congregation and said that about half of today's church has some problem with some facet of moral impurity in various forms. He conducted a seminar last winter for the pastors on the district which the DS required all pastors to attend in their zones.

[Wilson L. Deaton]

My Charge:

My charge to the congregation today is for you all to treasure moral purity—mine, the purity of the staff, and, the purity of entire congregation.

Be bold! Call me to be accountable if you see anything morally suggestive or questionable in my life. I give you permission to confront me, as I will in turn likewise confront you.

My Pledge:

I love you all and one thing this means is that I am fully accountable to God, to my General and District Leaders, to the Staff, to the Church Board, and, to the entire Congregation. My pledge to you all is that I will do whatever is necessary to maintain moral purity.


[NazNetters...help! ... Just let me know of any improvements you make! I believe this, or whatever it evolves into, could raise the tide of moral purity IN the Church and address the skepticism OUTSIDE the Church.]


Wes, I think these kinds of things are nearly always a good idea. Kudos to you for initiating this. :fav18

The only initial thought in terms of "tweaking" that comes to mind is that I've read (and practiced with some positive results) that concrete action with this sort of thing helps people to take it more seriously. Consider creating a little pledge card with a pledge for congregants to make and having the congregation sign them and either place them on the altar or keep them, whichever you think is best. Just a thought.

Wilson

[Doug Kitchen]

It is with fear and trembling and super anticipation that I hit the "Submit New Thread Button!]

Friend,

Wes


I think this is a great response to a difficult situation. As a parishioner, I would receive this pledge warmly.

Doug

[Anne and Dwayne Hood]

Our teen age grandchildren wear purity rings.

[Dave McClung]

The situation at Gig Harbor has had a significant impact upon my life and ministry. In short...I am convinced that one good thing that could emerge from that dramatic failure is if pastors and churches would become proactive re. the moral purity issue. These tragedies come and go and we pastors and leaders tend to hunker down and hope for as little collateral damage as possible.

This Sunday morning in my Pentecost Message, I am going to read the following "Purity Pledge" when I come to the point about...tongues of fire:

Purity Pledge:

Pastoral calling is a gift from Almighty God.

My confession:

I know this calling rests on the condition of the thoughts of my mind which flow from my spirit, my relationship with God.

Today I hold in my hand the visible symbol of my pastoral calling, my ordination. Thirty-two years ago in Sacramento, CA, Dr. Edward Lawlor placed his hands on my head and commissioned me to be an ordained pastor.

That ordination was presented in the context of moral purity.

It is with humility and with sanctified pride in the grace of God that I proclaim today that moral purity has been treasured and maintained in my life for all the years of my ministry. Colleen has been, and is, my one and only.

My Charge:

My charge to the congregation today is for you all to treasure moral purity—mine, the purity of the staff, and, the purity of entire congregation.

Be bold! Call me to be accountable if you see anything morally suggestive or questionable in my life. I give you permission to confront me, as I will in turn likewise confront you.

My Pledge:

I love you all and one thing this means is that I am fully accountable to God, to my General and District Leaders, to the Staff, to the Church Board, and, to the entire Congregation. My pledge to you all is that I will do whatever is necessary to maintain moral purity.


[NazNetters...help! This is my clumsy attempt to open dialogue in my congregation and to possibly get a positive moral movement started. Help me improve this pledge and make it something Pastors and Staff Members can present to the Congregation on an annual basis. Feel free to tweak the document and use it in your own situation. Just let me know of any improvements you make! I believe this, or whatever it evolves into, could raise the tide of moral purity IN the Church and address the skepticism OUTSIDE the Church. My reason for presenting it on Pentecost Sunday has some to do with thoughts I've had about a "Purity Sunday" that seem to coincide.

It is with fear and trembling and super anticipation that I hit the "Submit New Thread Button!]

Friend,

Wes

[SIZE=3]Wes

I am all for "Purity Sunday." I respect you and the other members of the clergy who are responding to the failure in Gig Harbor with assurance designed to strengthen confidence in the clergy.

At that same time, I know that such a pledge wouldn't have made a difference in Gig Harbor. Our pastor would have stood in the pulpit and taken the pledge without giving a hint that somethng was wrong.

I have some ideas about what could have been done to make a difference, but it is too soon for me to offer them. At this point, it would seem that I am being critical. Once the pain of this particular failure has subsided, I will have some suggestions.

[Belinda Y. Edwards]

i have waited a few days to respond to this thread, for i wanted to make sure my thoughts weren't based in emotion.

What i sense from this thread is knee jerk reaction.

No church failed.
No district failed.

It would have failed had the church turned the other way - ignored the cries for help.

*******
This church (as in the church that existed before becoming CrossWalk Community - this is one reason that it was needful for a newstart status) has a history of covering up for many years - many victims. There were some who actually paid off victims and families to keep their mouths shut.

Finally the man was caught when his girlfriend found tapes of him with victims and turned it over to the police. The split came here when the ones who helped cover up through all the years felt that the compassionate Christian responsibility of this church - would be to be his accountability and safe haven when he got out of jail. Garry refused. (to do what is right has a price, too - sometimes)

This is a picture of what i would call - failure.

***********

Not all pastors abuse their daughters. They shouldn't all have to prove they don't.
Not all lay people abuse the children of the church - they shouldn't all have to prove they don't.
Not all men abuse their wives or children on an emotional, physical or mental level - all men shouldn't have to prove they don't.

********

May Gig Harbor hold its head high - that it did what it had to do (not what it wanted to do).

May Gig Harbor be at peace today.

You didn't fail.

***********
edited to apologize for the verbiage of *a few days*. my concept of time is messed up at this time. i'll be back to normal one day. Thanks in advance for understanding.

[Alisa Stoll]

[SIZE="4"]The situation at Gig Harbor has had a significant impact upon my life and ministry. In short...I am convinced that one good thing that could emerge from that dramatic failure is if pastors and churches would become proactive re. the moral purity issue. These tragedies come and go and we pastors and leaders tend to hunker down and hope for as little collateral damage as possible.

This Sunday morning in my Pentecost Message, I am going to read the following "Purity Pledge" when I come to the point about...tongues of fire:

Purity Pledge:

Pastoral calling is a gift from Almighty God.

My confession:

I know this calling rests on the condition of the thoughts of my mind which flow from my spirit, my relationship with God.

Today I hold in my hand the visible symbol of my pastoral calling, my ordination. Thirty-two years ago in Sacramento, CA, Dr. Edward Lawlor placed his hands on my head and commissioned me to be an ordained pastor.

That ordination was presented in the context of moral purity.

It is with humility and with sanctified pride in the grace of God that I proclaim today that moral purity has been treasured and maintained in my life for all the years of my ministry. Colleen has been, and is, my one and only.

My Charge:

My charge to the congregation today is for you all to treasure moral purity—mine, the purity of the staff, and, the purity of entire congregation.

Be bold! Call me to be accountable if you see anything morally suggestive or questionable in my life. I give you permission to confront me, as I will in turn likewise confront you.

My Pledge:

I love you all and one thing this means is that I am fully accountable to God, to my General and District Leaders, to the Staff, to the Church Board, and, to the entire Congregation. My pledge to you all is that I will do whatever is necessary to maintain moral purity.


[NazNetters...help! This is my clumsy attempt to open dialogue in my congregation and to possibly get a positive moral movement started. Help me improve this pledge and make it something Pastors and Staff Members can present to the Congregation on an annual basis. Feel free to tweak the document and use it in your own situation. Just let me know of any improvements you make! I believe this, or whatever it evolves into, could raise the tide of moral purity IN the Church and address the skepticism OUTSIDE the Church. My reason for presenting it on Pentecost Sunday has some to do with thoughts I've had about a "Purity Sunday" that seem to coincide.

It is with fear and trembling and super anticipation that I hit the "Submit New Thread Button!]

Friend,

Wes


My only issue is the following "My charge to the congregation today is for you all to treasure moral purity—mine, the purity of the staff, and, the purity of entire congregation.

Be bold! Call me to be accountable if you see anything morally suggestive or questionable in my life. I give you permission to confront me, as I will in turn likewise confront you."

My issue is that I hope you have non-Christians in your congregation and by default they would not meet your purity requirement - they can't on their own. So clarifying that to "My charge to the congregation today is for you all to treasure moral purity - mine, the purity of the staf, and the pruity of the congregation. Be bold! Call me to be accountable if you see anything morally suggestive or questionable in my life. I give you permission to confront me. I too will confront anything morally suggestive or questionable that happens in the church or at a church sponsored event and in addition will confront any personal issues that I see in any Christian's life." would make it more clear. The earlier suggestion of filling in a card is a good one so then it would be "I too will confront anything morally suggestive or questionable that happens in the church or at a church sponsored event and in addition will confront any personal issues that I see in those of you who return the card."

Alisa

[Dave McClung]

Wes, I think these kinds of things are nearly always a good idea. Kudos to you for initiating this. :fav18

The only initial thought in terms of "tweaking" that comes to mind is that I've read (and practiced with some positive results) that concrete action with this sort of thing helps people to take it more seriously. Consider creating a little pledge card with a pledge for congregants to make and having the congregation sign them and either place them on the altar or keep them, whichever you think is best. Just a thought.

Wilson

Wes

Is there a way that you can specifically include the Internet Code of Ethics in your "purity pledge?"

As I have learned more facts concerning the misconduct that took place in Gig Harbor, I have come to realize that the criminal misconduct grew out of visiting inappropriate sites on the internet. This is the second time in less than three years that a young pastor that was close to me has surrendered his credentials. In both cases, the misconduct grew out of an addiction to porn on the internet.

The Internet Code of Ethics can be found here:

http://www.naznet.com/community/showthread.php?t=2807

[Meghan Schoonover]

Committment to a pledge is not going to fix or even necessarily prevent anything. We can expose a problem and renew our committment, but committment itself doesn't do a whole lot...otherwise I'd be able to drop this 20 lbs. and wouldn't struggle with depression.

We need to understand that through Christ's blood we can be free, that we have the body of Christ to help us, and we have various resources to help the struggling (such as recovery programs, accountability partners, internet filters, etc.). But human will and committment alone will fail. They will!

I understand your heart, dear pastor, and I agree with you fully. As Christians we should be the moral compasses of the world. But the fact is, we have just as much of a divorce rate, incest, premarital sex, out-of-wedlock pregnancies, affairs, and porn issues as "the world" does. A renewed committment alone is not going to solve or prevent those problems.

[Wesley Smith]

Your feedback is helpful. My concern about this issue revolves around our inability to have any safeguards in place. It could be that we are doing the best we can by just demonstrating trust. However, I'm going to continue to apply some pressure until it is clear that there is nothing we can do. Someone told me lately that 65% of all pastors, according to a Focus on the Family survey, are into porn. That seems high to me. But what percentage would we be comfortable with? Even 20% or 10% seems unacceptable. I do know that we received a significant number of prayer requests at PALCON from pastors who were seeking deliverance from pornography.

This is a very complicated issue. I think we all agree that pastoral accountability is essential, but the bottom line seems to be that pastors who are compromising morally will likely lie. My personal hope in sharing a purity creed with my congregation is that it could do something to build trust and meaningful accountability. It could be that the voluntary offering of a purity creed could say something very positive about the person offering it. Not sure. Will post any feedback that comes my way.

Thanks again!

Wes

[Wesley Smith]

Wes

Is there a way that you can specifically include the Internet Code of Ethics in your "purity pledge?"

As I have learned more facts concerning the misconduct that took place in Gig Harbor, I have come to realize that the criminal misconduct grew out of visiting inappropriate sites on the internet. This is the second time in less than three years that a young pastor that was close to me has surrendered his credentials. In both cases, the misconduct grew out of an addiction to porn on the internet.

The Internet Code of Ethics can be found here:

http://www.naznet.com/community/showthread.php?t=2807

Excellent.

This is such a complicated issue. The internet is an amazing source of tempation. There are obviously other factors...a satisfying marriage, a person's sexual past, thought life, activities in spare time, etc.

The main thing I am convinced of at this point is that if we do nothing, we can surely expect more failure and if the past teaches anything it is that silence is nowhere close to golden.

I wonder if psychological testing would be helpful in helping us determine more accurately who is qualified for ministry/ordination. Our missionary candidates, as I understand it, submit to such tests. Police checks? I think you mentioned that a check had been run on Stephen. I had never heard of a police check being run on a pastor. Hmmm.

Wes

[Meghan Schoonover]

[SIZE="4"]Excellent.
I had never heard of a police check being run on a pastor. Hmmm.


Golly...I hope we run background checks on pastors...really, we don't? Everyone in our church who works with children gets a background check. I think that's only common sense. People convicted of sexual offences have a very high chance of recurrance...that's why they aren't allowed to be close to schools, etc. Of course, that doesn't help if the person doesn't have a history or hasn't been caught yet. <sigh>

[Dave McClung]

Excellent.

This is such a complicated issue. The internet is an amazing source of tempation. There are obviously other factors...a satisfying marriage, a person's sexual past, thought life, activities in spare time, etc.

The main thing I am convinced of at this point is that if we do nothing, we can surely expect more failure and if the past teaches anything it is that silence is nowhere close to golden.

I wonder if psychological testing would be helpful in helping us determine more accurately who is qualified for ministry/ordination. Our missionary candidates, as I understand it, submit to such tests. Police checks? I think you mentioned that a check had been run on Stephen. I had never heard of a police check being run on a pastor. Hmmm.

Wes

Our insurance company requires background checks on everyone who will possibly be alone with children. That includes the pastor. Just before all of this came to light, they added a requirement that the background checks be done through a specific company -- their choice.

I know that some districts in the ENC Region require all those seeking credentials from the district to go through a week end of evaluation. It includes some testing.

I don't know how well it works, but one of the individuals I mentioned who turned in his credentials went through the evaluation. Less than two years after he was ordained, he surrendered his credentials for "porn addiction."

[Dave McClung]

Golly...I hope we run background checks on pastors...really, we don't? Everyone in our church who works with children gets a background check. I think that's only common sense. People convicted of sexual offences have a very high chance of recurrance...that's why they aren't allowed to be close to schools, etc. Of course, that doesn't help if the person doesn't have a history or hasn't been caught yet. <sigh>

Evidentally Wes wasn't aware, but a background check was run on him before he was called to Longview. This district runs a check on each pastor before he or she is invited to the district.

[Meghan Schoonover]

My personal hope in sharing a purity creed with my congregation is that it could do something to build trust and meaningful accountability. It could be that the voluntary offering of a purity creed could say something very positive about the person offering it.

<thinking> So, your real purpose is to assure your congregation of your purity, rather than what your congregants do? I was approaching it from a congregant viewpoint. As a parishioner it would probably reassure me to hear a promise and "good history," as you said, but also that you have some safeguards in place, such as, oh, say, internet filters, rules regarding meeting with women, background checks, etc. Something to the effect of, "This is a huge issue of temptation both inside and outside of the ministry. These are some things I've done (or plan to do)."

Hope that helps!

[Hans Deventer]

I wonder if psychological testing would be helpful in helping us determine more accurately who is qualified for ministry/ordination.

We have such a test on our district since a couple of years.

[Jeremy D. Scott]

I took four tests yesterday in one part of the Assessment for the New England District. Two were ministry giftedness tests, and the other were more so personality tests. My wife took three of them alongside me. There will soon be a police check. This usually happens here for those who are seeking their first district license. I am a bit different because I'm receiving my fourth district license, but I transferred into the district. The NED doesn't assume anything and runs all transfers through the same process as if they were receiving their first license.

Listen, this is difficult, it really is. It's human nature for the rest of us to question where we could have stopped what's happened. Believe me, I confess that it was haunting for my wife and I yesterday as we watched and prayed at our district ordination gathering for each of those couples. We couldn't help but be reminded of the fact that this pastor was ordained just several weeks prior to what happened. I don't blame anyone for asking, "Where did we go wrong?" The unfortunate fact is that these things are going to happen. It's also part of the fallen nature of humanity and will be until the final reconciliation and triumph. Let's do our best to avert it when we can, but not blame ourselves when it does happen.

[Belinda Y. Edwards]

I took four tests yesterday in one part of the Assessment for the New England District. Two were ministry giftedness tests, and the other were more so personality tests. My wife took three of them alongside me. There will soon be a police check. This usually happens here for those who are seeking their first district license. I am a bit different because I'm receiving my fourth district license, but I transferred into the district. The NED doesn't assume anything and runs all transfers through the same process as if they were receiving their first license.

Listen, this is difficult, it really is. It's human nature for the rest of us to question where we could have stopped what's happened. Believe me, I confess that it was haunting for my wife and I yesterday as we watched and prayed at our district ordination gathering for each of those couples. We couldn't help but be reminded of the fact that this pastor was ordained just several weeks prior to what happened. I don't blame anyone for asking, "Where did we go wrong?" The unfortunate fact is that these things are going to happen. It's also part of the fallen nature of humanity and will be until the final reconciliation and triumph. Let's do our best to avert it when we can, but not blame ourselves when it does happen.

i really appreciate this post, Jeremy.

Background checks and personality tests - - most all professions request this these days. This, to me, is standard.

It is even getting to the point that potential in-laws are doing background checks into ones dating their children -even checking out financial and health issues.

Blame is human nature, too. It is part of the grief process.

What you are acknowledging about looking at the other couples and wondering is what i have sensed in the deepest recesses of my heart after reading several posts on the subject. This isn't fair.

We have finally (i think) as pastoral families moved to the point where we could breathe a tiny bit in the midst of our humanity. This? To look at each other with suspicion - how is that with our theology?

[Jeremy D. Scott]

What you are acknowledging about looking at the other couples and wondering is what i have sensed in the deepest recesses of my heart after reading several posts on the subject. This isn't fair.

We have finally (i think) as pastoral families moved to the point where we could breathe a tiny bit in the midst of our humanity. This? To look at each other with suspicion - how is that with our theology?

I didn't mean to imply that I was looking at the couples suspiciously. I know four of the five couples who were ordained. What I meant is that it was haunting to consider how the events of the last several weeks transpired.

I remember thinking in the past that the question that the GS often asks - very publicly - when handing over the ordination credential of, "Will you keep this pure and promise that the day you don't you'll give it back?" was a bit over-the-top...harsh, even, to imply that that individual might have that possibility in his/her life.

In light of recent events - and not just this one most recently - this question seemed most appropriate to me this time, yesterday as I watched the ordination of those couples.

One of the things that I think has hurt us - and I mostly mean pastors just in this instance - is our assumption, as involuntary or unconscious as it may be, that we are beyond falling. It's when we think "we couldn't do that" that perhaps we are most susceptible. My wife and I have used these occurrences - when we hear something like this happen - as a reminder of our frailty.

I'll never forget the moment that a former Nazarene elder - a great leader in the CotN (still a great leader in my mind) - sat down across from my wife and I, apologized to us for his fall, and demanded that we acknowledge always that we too are not beyond temptation and fall.

[Belinda Y. Edwards]

I didn't mean to imply that I was looking at the couples suspiciously. I know four of the five couples who were ordained. What I meant is that it was haunting to consider how the events of the last several weeks transpired.

I remember thinking in the past that the question that the GS often asks - very publicly - when handing over the ordination credential of, "Will you keep this pure and promise that the day you don't you'll give it back?" was a bit over-the-top...harsh, even, to imply that that individual might have that possibility in his/her life.

In light of recent events - and not just this one most recently - this question seemed most appropriate to me this time, yesterday as I watched the ordination of those couples.

One of the things that I think has hurt us - and I mostly mean pastors just in this instance - is our assumption, as involuntary or unconscious as it may be, that we are beyond falling. It's when we think "we couldn't do that" that perhaps we are most susceptible. My wife and I have used these occurrences - when we hear something like this happen - as a reminder of our frailty.

I'll never forget the moment that a former Nazarene elder - a great leader in the CotN (still a great leader in my mind) - sat down across from my wife and I, apologized to us for his fall, and demanded that we acknowledge always that we too are not beyond temptation and fall.

Jeremy, i come to this page today with more than just being pastor's wife, now. i have recently sat through a similarly sobering day where we as future nurses were cautioned of the temptations that lurked beyond the walls - just on the other side. Very detailed ways, reasons and confessions of nurses who had become substance abusers. One of the very things we are trained to aid in healing for others, nurses are finding themselves to be the patients, too. Research is finding that 50% of the nurses out there have become substance abusers on one level or another.

Two of the reasons that they are siting to be why they fall into this trap is the intense pressure to be *perfect* and the intense pressure to *always be positive with a smile*. How does this smack with the pressure that is upon pastors? Am i seeking an excuse? No. i come to this page - pleading that it not be a *pastoral* issue but a humanity issue.

We were urged as future nurses to *turn ourselves in* and get help. We were walked through the process of rehabilitation and restoration. We were told that we could run the risk of being in trouble ourselves should a coworker be found with a substance abuse and we didn't report them. i hear and i understand but i refuse to walk onto the unit with eyes seeking to seek out those who have fallen. i cannot and i refuse to operate my life that way.

Somewhere i seek balance. i am reminded of the scripture in Revelations regarding the last days, "turning brother against brother".

Balance i plea - balance.

[Hans Deventer]

Balance i plea - balance.

Yes. But as long as the church is a place where we need to wear the emperor's clothes, that balance will be hard to achieve.

I used to think the church should be a community of saints. But no longer. I now see the church as a hospital for sinners, where we all are both staff and patient at the same time, though with different staff roles. We all desperately need the Great Physician. And could do with less anaesthetics.

[Anne and Dwayne Hood]

Dwayne is retired from the pastorate now, but the DS has classed him as Retired--assigned. He is out visiting sick and elderly people today.
These police checks are brand new to me, and I totally understand the need for them.Some may have good reports, but still not all they should be. Once a pastor whispered something that was not nice to me, when I was a pastor's wife. I immediately turned to his wife, and told her what he said. I think that it was something that she had lived with for a long time. He has not been a pastor for several years now. Wehn sometone makes a move or says something that should not have been said, I have learned that it should be brought out right then, if possible, rather than let it be a secret between a man and woman.

[Billy Cox]

I don't know how well it works, but one of the individuals I mentioned who turned in his credentials went through the evaluation. Less than two years after he was ordained, he surrendered his credentials for "porn addiction."

Background checks can only tell whether the individual has in the past been convicted of illegal activity. Most tests and interviews will only catch someone who is not very good at deception. Even accountable relationships are not a guaranteed protection.

If someone is determined to deceive those around them, they will likely succeed for a time. It is the Church's responsibility to make sure that the amount of time is as short as possible.

[Wesley Smith]

I presented the "Purity Pledge" as a part of the Pentecost Sunday Message. You can listen to the message at www.longviewchurch.org Just a note about the message...I was doing my best to try to address some needs in our local congregation, so if you do listen to the message, please understand that much was said in the message that wasn't actually spoken.

My reponse at this point is that I am going to post the "Purity Pledge" on the wall in my office right beside my ordination certificate and I plan to repeat the pledge on an annual basis.

Thanks, again, for your valuable input. I will use your input to tweak some of the content of the pledge.

The response from the congregation was extremely positive. Many people went out of their way to express appreciation.

The main target for the pledge was...my heart and my relationship with the congregation. Something happened in my thinking that is akin to setting a goal and making it public. It changes much about how one acts and thinks. Since this past Sunday I have already had several interruptions in my thought process that have raised the questions, "How does what I'm doing right now, or, thinking right now, help or hurt me in the purity process?"

Just one little example...Sunday evening I conducted a wedding. For twenty years, or more, I have practiced giving gummie bears to kids. They receive one gummie bear if they greet me in the foyer. Historically...they receive one of each color if they come to my office. My hope has been to make a positive spiritual connection with them. It is easy to see that this innocent hope is fraught with, in context, negative possibilities. The first "group" of children (5 of them) came to my office to receive their gummie bears. No problem. A few minutes later while I was in the sanctuary a little one came to say she had not received gb's. No problem. We rounded up two other children to accompany us. Just an example.

It truly makes me mad that the direction of our culture has made it difficult for a pure pastor to love children and help guide them to Jesus. But, such are the times.

This emphasis has taken my own consideration of moral purity to the next level. It has also brought me to a conclusion that a focus on and commitment to moral purity in the clergy will not happen by accident.

Friend,

Wes

[Dave McClung]

I presented the "Purity Pledge" as a part of the Pentecost Sunday Message. You can listen to the message at www.longviewchurch.org (http://www.longviewchurch.org) Just a note about the message...I was doing my best to try to address some needs in our local congregation, so if you do listen to the message, please understand that much was said in the message that wasn't actually spoken.

My reponse at this point is that I am going to post the "Purity Pledge" on the wall in my office right beside my ordination certificate and I plan to repeat the pledge on an annual basis.

Thanks, again, for your valuable input. I will use your input to tweak some of the content of the pledge.

The response from the congregation was extremely positive. Many people went out of their way to express appreciation.

The main target for the pledge was...my heart and my relationship with the congregation. Something happened in my thinking that is akin to setting a goal and making it public. It changes much about how one acts and thinks. Since this past Sunday I have already had several interruptions in my thought process that have raised the questions, "How does what I'm doing right now, or, thinking right now, help or hurt me in the purity process?"

Just one little example...Sunday evening I conducted a wedding. For twenty years, or more, I have practiced giving gummie bears to kids. They receive one gummie bear if they greet me in the foyer. Historically...they receive one of each color if they come to my office. My hope has been to make a positive spiritual connection with them. It is easy to see that this innocent hope is fraught with, in context, negative possibilities. The first "group" of children (5 of them) came to my office to receive their gummie bears. No problem. A few minutes later while I was in the sanctuary a little one came to say she had not received gb's. No problem. We rounded up two other children to accompany us. Just an example.

It truly makes me mad that the direction of our culture has made it difficult for a pure pastor to love children and help guide them to Jesus. But, such are the times.

This emphasis has taken my own consideration of moral purity to the next level. It has also brought me to a conclusion that a focus on and commitment to moral purity in the clergy will not happen by accident.

Friend,

Wes

I applaude you for being proactive. This morning, I met with the representative of our insurance agency to review their requirements for our insurance policy. Some of their requirements don't make a lot of sense, but the insurance company is having to do what "the church" should have done on its own.

Most of their requirements are intended to prevent preditors from being alone with vulnerable individuals. Some of the requirements will make it almost impossible for a small church to get insurance -- never less than two adults present when children are there.

In the future, a pastor will not be able to bring his or her children to the church property unless an official church function is underway.

New attendees will not be able to accept responsibility for children until they have been a part of the congregation for at least 3 months.

Once I have our new policy drafted, I will post it on NazNet for comment.

[Meghan Schoonover]

The main target for the pledge was...my heart and my relationship with the congregation. Something happened in my thinking that is akin to setting a goal and making it public. It changes much about how one acts and thinks. Since this past Sunday I have already had several interruptions in my thought process that have raised the questions, "How does what I'm doing right now, or, thinking right now, help or hurt me in the purity process?"

:fav18 Thanks for the clarification. When I first read you post I thought it was you making a pledge and being "an example" to the congregation to make a like-wise pledge. That's why my focus on the "willpower alone won't work." I am glad you are taking some proactive steps and it's involved heightened awareness, too.

[Ryan Scott]

3 months is not too bad. I know of some congregations whose insurance requires one year.

[Wesley Smith]

In the future, a pastor will not be able to bring his or her children to the church property unless an official church function is underway.

New attendees will not be able to accept responsibility for children until they have been a part of the congregation for at least 3 months.

Dave,

Are these requirements only for Gig Harbor, or the entire District? A pastor cannot bring his child/children to the church unless it is a formal congregational/group event? Wow! That is huge!

Wes

[Belinda Y. Edwards]

3 months is not too bad. I know of some congregations whose insurance requires one year.

We require at least 6 months and prefer over a year.

As for being alone in the church - we have long established that we want at least two adults (from different families) in the building. This isn't just for pastoral families but also for lay. Only board members have a key and we keep close tabs on who is in the building when. We changed locks and went to this about five years ago.

Our insurance company is very strict. i will be curious to watch to see if this will have an effect all across the US. i suspect that it will.

[Kevin Rector]

In the future, a pastor will not be able to bring his or her children to the church property unless an official church function is underway.

I just don't understand the point of that one. If a pastor is going to abuse their children he/she could do it at home when the spouse is away just as easily as at the church.

There is something utterly sad in this whole thread (even if it might be necessary). It seems to me that we have come to a point where the sick people of our world has so filled us with fear that we get to the point where we have to stop being who we are.

In addition to having a policy of how to keep people from abusing vulnerable others, is the church going to have a policy on how to minister to those who have been abused. Bad stuff happens, you really can't keep it out. But how you respond to it, that is the most important question.

If we throw trust out the window we can not be the church. Yet if we trust, then we will (eventually) get hurt by someone who was good at pretending to be worthy of trust. So how do we find that balance to protect the innocent as much as possible while still trusting each other? I have a hard time believing that increasing written policies will do that.

[Ryan Scott]

I'm guessing that one is more for the congregation's insurance policy. You're right, leaving it at that doesn't sound very much like the Church, although I assume Dave's congregation will be committed to working with the Pastor beyond just the stipulations of the building policy.

[Jim Monck]

I applaude you for being proactive. This morning, I met with the representative of our insurance agency to review their requirements for our insurance policy. Some of their requirements don't make a lot of sense, but the insurance company is having to do what "the church" should have done on its own.

Most of their requirements are intended to prevent preditors from being alone with vulnerable individuals. Some of the requirements will make it almost impossible for a small church to get insurance -- never less than two adults present when children are there.

In the future, a pastor will not be able to bring his or her children to the church property unless an official church function is underway.

New attendees will not be able to accept responsibility for children until they have been a part of the congregation for at least 3 months.

Once I have our new policy drafted, I will post it on NazNet for comment.



You are right Dave, no more "we need a couple more workers for VBS this next week or some one to drive a couple teens to camp." On and on goes the list, but not only is the challenge to set up the policy, but how do you monitor it? What if a teen drops by the church to say hello to the pastor? Some of these things become impossible for the small church that does not have a full time secretary.

How are things going for your church, the former pastor and his family? How do I even ask that without feeling nosey and yet realizing these are all real people, even the man who sinned.

[Jim Monck]

I just don't understand the point of that one. If a pastor is going to abuse their children he/she could do it at home when the spouse is away just as easily as at the church.

There is something utterly sad in this whole thread (even if it might be necessary). It seems to me that we have come to a point where the sick people of our world has so filled us with fear that we get to the point where we have to stop being who we are.

In addition to having a policy of how to keep people from abusing vulnerable others, is the church going to have a policy on how to minister to those who have been abused. Bad stuff happens, you really can't keep it out. But how you respond to it, that is the most important question.

If we throw trust out the window we can not be the church. Yet if we trust, then we will (eventually) get hurt by someone who was good at pretending to be worthy of trust. So how do we find that balance to protect the innocent as much as possible while still trusting each other? I have a hard time believing that increasing written policies will do that.

Kevin I agree with you, but!

Recently an insurance man told me that if you do not have a policy in place and something does happen you can kiss your church goodbye. You will loose everything you have and that not only means the church building but also the risk official board members face. Be sure to check your insurance coverage for your official board.

I wish this were not a part of the day we live in but watch the number of adds on tv by law firms looking for clients.

Ministry involves risk; I cannot run scared but the Catholic Church is not the only one being sued. We also have to remember a law suit does not just involve the local church but goes to the district and general church.

Just some thoughts and I confess not pleasent ones at that. It is not fair that the actions of a few should effect so many. Have you taken a flight anywhere lately?

[Kevin Rector]

In the future, a pastor will not be able to bring his or her children to the church property unless an official church function is underway.


At this exact moment my 3 year old son is in the fellowship hall just outside my study door playing with Legos and a Buzz Lightyear action figure. We are the only two people in the building and it reminded me of your church's rule.

So I got to thinking, since I'm working on my sermon does that count as an official church function? :)

Really, if that rule were in effect in our church it would be an onerous burden. We have two children, one is two years old and one is three years old. To get anything accomplished while watching both of them is a real challenge, but if you separate them and have one parent take each they are very easy to take care of. My wife had to take our daughter to the doctor and then has a lunch date with a lady from the church. It would be very difficult to do that with both kids (she's done it many times, but it's challenging) and since her having lunch is a ministry action it's important for her to be able to focus on that.

So we split the kids up. I took our son who is really low maintenance and I'll work here at the church. We couldn't do that (or at least I couldn't get any work done) if we had your church's rule.

I'm glad that we have Church Mutual. I'm not sure if they are licensed to sell insurance in your state, but if they are you might want to look into switching to them. They are a company that wants to make a profit but they also at least seem to understand the unique aspects of being a church since all that they insure is churches.

[Meghan Schoonover]

Kevin, I think the deal is that some of the abuse happened at the church, so naturally everyone is feeling a little more sensitive due to that fact.

[Kevin Rector]

Kevin, I think the deal is that some of the abuse happened at the church, so naturally everyone is feeling a little more sensitive due to that fact.

Right I understand that, but as I understand it (and I might be mistaken) this new rule comes from the insurance company not from the leadership of the church. Also, I am cognizant of the fact that perhaps this rule will work for Gig Harbor.

The reality though is that the vast majority of pastors are not going to abuse a child in their church building. So the odds of what happened at their church ever happening again is absolutely minuscule.

I wouldn't presume to tell Gig Harbor what to do, and I apologize if it sounds like I am, I honestly have no idea what it would be like to go through what they are going through.

My only point is that I would hate for them to tie the hands of a future pastor out of fear of what he/she might do because of the actions of a previous pastor; actions that at least statistically speaking are almost assuredly never going happen again.

If I came to interview at a church and they told me I was never to bring my children to the church building with me except for official church functions it would take a pretty clear sign from God for me to not turn that church down if they called me.

[Glenda Harvey]

The Church I attend requires a finger print clearance for anyone, volunteer or paid staff, who will be in a position of working with children or teenagers. Volunteers also fill out an application of sorts in which they give there personal testimony and say why they want to work with children and what their past experience is. The application asks for three references.

One thing that I remember in the Church I grew up in (I think because it was such a small church) was that people would be placed in leadership roles or in Sunday School teaching roles almost as soon as they became members or began attending. I don't know if this still goes on, but it is not a good idea.

[Glenda Harvey]

I love that we can edit what we have written, even after we have already posted.