I've Changed My Mind

[Ryan Scott]

Since recently I've been a very active participant in a number of discussions that seem to be quite polarizing, I wanted to add this thread as a way for us to express changes of opinions as a result of these or other discussions in life.


I, for one, have dealt quite heavily over the last year or two with the issue of war and pacifism. Personally, for me it was never an issue. The only time I've ever had any sort of violent inclination was in extreme anger and even then I was rarely able to bring myself to act upon it. I'm just not that kind of person. I could never hurt anyone. I'm a pacifist.

That works great for me, but there are bigger issues than whether I would ever harm someone else in this world. I'm not a fan of the current war or any war in general, but I acknowledge the need and great benefit a well trained Army can have for good in the world.

I've spoken with military members (both current and retired), read the postings on this site, and had a few conversation with a family member who is preparing for another go-round in Iraq. I understand the honor in service, but I've struggled greatly with the idea that anyone could be a Christian and be in the military.

While I can't say my mind has been changed entirely, I've recently come to peace with that last issue. I've really come to understand the God-given grace necessary for a woman or man to commit to military service. This is a commitment to go where they are told and to willingly put their life on the line for friends and family, yes, but also for complete strangers, many of whom do not deserve to have a life given for them.

The correlation between this and Christ's teaching that no man has greater love than to lay down his life for his friends. That sort of sacrifice is beyond anything we can do on our own, it is a gift from God. While I may not agree with the way those in charge are using these precious gifts of service, I have a profound respect for the people willing and able to make them.


It's not much, but it's some evidence that my mind can be changed through these sorts of dialogues. I hope it would be a redeeming exercise if others would share similar instances in which a debate or conversation sparked real self-reflection and resulted in a softening or changing of opinions.

[Barb Bouldrey]

Ryan,

When I first came onto NazNet 7 years ago I learned a lot about understanding the context of scriptures through some of the discussions that included theologians and professors. They helped me understand terms like "fundamentalism," "open theism," and some things that were just "words" to me.

It has helped me see more of a world view by reading the posts from Hans, Ian, Roland and Carsten...people from other countries where the church is not as old as it is here. They have different viewpoints on some of the Manual statements because of where they live and how they have been raised.

It has opened my eyes to the fact that not all Nazarenes think alike when it comes to doctrine....but that we all love the Lord and want to worship Him.

Barb

[Ian Gentles]

We celebrated 25th anniversary od falklands war this last weekend when British forces liberated our Falkland Islands from Argenitina. I Gosse Green whole community was locked up in one large community centre, two toilets, so plenty is dysentry etc, they rejoiced in been liberated, but battle to liberate them was bloody. War is very nasty, but on occasions neccesary sadly. Prefer there was no wars at all.

[Gina Stevenson]

It has opened my eyes to the fact that not all Nazarenes think alike when it comes to doctrine....but that we all love the Lord and want to worship Him.

Barb

Living here & there is what helped do this for me ... also, attending some non-Naz churches here or there, too, has "broadened my horizons" over a lifetime. ;)

[David Pettigrew]

The first debate I ever got into on naznet was over the issue of whether our churches should be required to put "Nazarene" in their name. I came out strongly that they should.

I still feel it's a good idea, but I see no point in requiring it. It's pretty irrelevant in the world we live in today.

I've probably changed my mind on other things, but that's off the top of my head.

Good idea for a thread!

[Scott Hilton]

I don't know if I have any specific topics where I have changed my mind, but I have seen my approach to message board discussions change in the 2 years that I have participated in on line "discussions" :rolleyes: about topics.

I used to go in with the goal of proving my point and was not really interested in hearing the other view. After numerous discussions that forced me to back up what I was saying in a deeper way than I was ready sometimes and sometimes feeling great sorrow at the way I had replied to people, my view on discussing matters on message boards has changed. I now go in hoping to express what I believe in a way comes across in love and be accepting of other views even if I in the end don't agree with them. In other words, I go in willing to be wrong instread of only willing to be right.

This is especially true of the topic of OSAS on another site that I have been a member on for quite some time. I still don't agree with the doctrine and really don't get much "meat" out of the discussions on it anymore, but when I do enter into it, it is like a completely different person than 2 years ago. There is a guy on the site who I think our discussion became somewhat legendary on the site, unfortunatly its not because either one of us came across as theologians, but as rude. We have come a long way in our discussions and in our faith now. It is a noticeable difference when we both have counterpoints now. However, we now do it with respect and love.

I am of course by no means saying I am innocent of never doing this anymore, my "self" still likes to peek its ugly self out sometimes, but it is far less now than before.

So, I guess the biggest thing I have learned in my experiences on discussion boards is that I can be wrong and if I am not willing to be wrong going in, I will probably not get a whole lot out of a discussion in the end of it.

blessings
Scott

[Marsha Lynn]

I don't know if I have any specific topics where I have changed my mind, but I have seen my approach to message board discussions change in the 2 years that I have participated in on line "discussions" :rolleyes: about topics.

I once dug into the old AOL forums seeking an update on a cultish church in which a friend is involved. I discovered that the group had split and there were message boards for each faction. However, people from one group kept going over to flame the other group. As I observed the bickering, I learned a couple of things about message boards:

1. It takes two to tango. There has to be both an agitator and someone who is willing to respond to their jabs. Squelching the latter will usually cause the former to get bored and leave.

2. Often a response would be thoughtful and respectful -- until the final statement. That final thought would negate all of the rational statements before it. For example (and this is only an example):

Scott, this is a useful post about forum discussion and I appreciate you making it. I don't necessarily agree with you but you expressed yourself well and weren't adversarial. [Here it comes ...] Not at all like your usual dribble.

I learned from that forum to look at my closing statement and delete it if it didn't add anything positive to the discussion. Often leaving off the final words changes the tone of the entire post.

Of course, some people never seem to catch on to these basic rules for online discussions.

Marsha
(see what I mean about the final statement? :basic05)

[David Pettigrew]

I once dug into the old AOL forums seeking an update on a cultish church in which a friend is involved. I discovered that the group had split and there were message boards for each faction.

Marsha
(see what I mean about the final statement? :basic05)

I wouldn't have been the BMC and PNC, would it?

[Marsha Lynn]

I wouldn't have been the BMC and PNC, would it?

Uhmm... I don't know what those letters stand for. It was the Worldwide CoG (trying to be cryptic enough to avoid bringing the search engines here). Old leadership died, new leadership rose up and decided to go with orthodoxy, which couldn't help but cause a furor, since part of the appeal was "secret knowledge" that would elevate one about ordinary Christians.

I watched a few of the broadcasts in the old days and one of the speaker's favorite phrases was, "Now, this is something you aren't likely to hear anywhere else..." And he was right. Not because other people didn't know about it but because it wasn't worth dwelling on. My friend drank it up. As a brand-new Christian he had been made to feel ignorant and ashamed in several situations and this organization opened the door for him to not only catch up with those who showed him such disdain but to surpass them in knowledge. Needless to say, he went with the group that splintered off after the announcement that the church was going to embrace orthodoxy.

Marsha

[Bob Evans]

Because of naznet

I've redecided that I need to listen more and argue less.

I've redecided that there are times that the less I say the better of I am.

I've redecided that sometime the thank you button is all that needs to be said.

I've redecided that experience is probably the best teacher.

I've redecided that Loving God and loving your neighbor really is the most important message that the bible has and everything else finishes in second place.

[David Pettigrew]

Uhmm... I don't know what those letters stand for. It was the Worldwide CoG (trying to be cryptic enough to avoid bringing the search engines here). Old leadership died, new leadership rose up and decided to go with orthodoxy, which couldn't help but cause a furor, since part of the appeal was "secret knowledge" that would elevate one about ordinary Christians.

I watched a few of the broadcasts in the old days and one of the speaker's favorite phrases was, "Now, this is something you aren't likely to hear anywhere else..." And he was right. Not because other people didn't know about it but because it wasn't worth dwelling on. My friend drank it up. As a brand-new Christian he had been made to feel ignorant and ashamed in several situations and this organization opened the door for him to not only catch up with those who showed him such disdain but to surpass them in knowledge. Needless to say, he went with the group that splintered off after the announcement that the church was going to embrace orthodoxy.

Marsha

I am familiar with the organization. I was talking about the Bible Missionary Church, which broke off from the Nazarenes in the 1950s and are incredibly legalistic. The Pilgrim Nazarene Church broke off from this group in 2003 over the usage of internet. They have a message board that is much as you described.

[Terri Knoll]

between conversations on Naznet and reading the Innocence Project, I am against the death penalty until all this DNA falderol is figured out. I think everyone on death row everywhere should be commuted to life, get more lawyers (pro bono) and legal assistants involved, find this DNA, release and PAY the innocent ones, and try very hard to find the real offenders. (IT happens alot once the DNA is entered into the databases)
If there is undaunting DNA evidence in child rapes/ murders, DEATH
all others life in prison, with more prisons being built in poverty stricken areas (they employ thousands of people)

of course, I could change my mind again :basic05

[Roland Hearn]

Naznet has had a significant place in the development of my understanding of grace. A lot of black and white issues where helped to become grey issues which has been an over all journey of my life and Naznet has been a part of that process. I'm trying to think of specific issues that have changed and I can't but I know there have been some. I think many ideas that were helped in their shaping by Naznet have become a part of my life so completely that I don't even think about them any more.

I remember one discussion with Dennis Bratcher way back in the beginning where I said something flipant and hurtful and he called me on it with love and grace. That was probably the single individual change that most stands out in my mind.

I have also learned a new skill from writing on Naznet. If I am writing from emotion the back of my neck gets prickly - that is always without an exception an indicator to delete what I have just written. It took me quite awhile to figure that out.

[Jeremy D. Scott]

I have also learned a new skill from writing on Naznet. If I am writing from emotion the back of my neck gets prickly - that is always without an exception an indicator to delete what I have just written. It took me quite awhile to figure that out.

It's probably 50% of posts that I write that actually get the experience of the "Submit Reply" button.