Passing the Buck!?

[Bob Woolley]

It’s called Passing the Buck!

Since when does truth become truth? In these days I am finding out that Yes, doesn’t mean yes anymore and No, doesn’t mean no! Here in our province we are having a problem of “keeping out Sunday Shopping”. The people of this province have voted “NO” to Sunday shopping. Yet, we have two major grocery supermarket chains breaking the law and opening on Sundays. It is now within the courts to solve this problem when the majority of Nova Scotians voted “NO” to Sunday shopping! Doesn’t NO mean NO?

Truth is therefore redundant! It really doesn’t mean anything to anyone anymore! Let me explain!

When you are a sales person and in order to be effective, you must focus on the positives of your product. If you run down the other person’s product, it becomes counterproductive. But even some still fall into this trap when selling. You have to remember that if you tear down another’s product or service, it does leave one thinking that if the competitor is that well known, then he must be a problem to the seller. It becomes counterproductive to run down another’s product. It leaves one wondering what is the truth?

Politicians never learn this lesson! They simply retaliate by fearing their opponent will try the same trickery to out-do them in a smear campaign. It is too risky to not retaliate first. Many times the winner loses respect because of his or her willingness to win at all costs. Therefore, we constantly wonder about the truth in their campaign or even if newspapers are correct in their assessments of their stories?

Now it moves into the field of marketing! Since when is a price correct or incorrect? Can we trust the seller to say that the price is what is stated?
Today, this is becoming a real problem. One can post a price on the internet and then have a statement at the bottom of the page saying that the price can be changed because it was a mistake in the first place. I had that happen to me today! I find the price was incorrect and the company is not responsible for pricing mistakes online! It was my fault to have trusted that the incorrect price was displayed.

So now we come to the area of the church. Is this issue or problem now creeping into the modern day church? Can the truth be trusted? Or do we as Christians, pass the buck? Jesus said, “I Am the Way, the Truth and the Life”. If the world sees little inconsistencies in our lives, are we living truth to the world? Did Jesus really say He was the Truth or was it a half-truth?

Frankly, friend, can you see the problem to an outsider? How important is it to live a holy life? How important is it to each church in every town, to live out the truth daily. How can we trust in an untruthful world if the church is untruthful in its daily life?

I leave this for you to answer, if there is an answer if there is an answer in this day and age? …. :basic04

[Marg Webb]

What if I am a Seventh Day Adventist?? What if I am a Jew.?

[Ken Smith]

Now it moves into the field of marketing! Since when is a price correct or incorrect? Can we trust the seller to say that the price is what is stated?
Today, this is becoming a real problem. One can post a price on the internet and then have a statement at the bottom of the page saying that the price can be changed because it was a mistake in the first place. I had that happen to me today! I find the price was incorrect and the company is not responsible for pricing mistakes online! It was my fault to have trusted that the incorrect price was displayed.

Hi Bob, I use the following on my site:

Rate & Site information are non binding and subject to change without notice.
This helps protect me from a frivolous law suit, and there are many out there that make it a career.

It is easy to save a webpage with certain info & pricing and keep it for years, within that time frame a website owner may need to make changes that are necessary but wasn't needed say, "6 months or a year prior".

My costs go up and I would not be able to stay in business if I kept mine the same forever.

I've been in the work force for 45 years now, I started out at 10 cents per hour, back in the 50's that was a lot of money to me.

Couldn't make it on 10 cents and hour today. :)

Not to make light of this, I am aware that some use "subject to change" as a way to rip people off.

I make an effort, "when I'm sane" :) to ask God to help me with discernment, it is much needed for sure.

Ken

[Bob Woolley]

Hi Bob, I use the following on my site:

Rate & Site information are non binding and subject to change without notice.
This helps protect me from a frivolous law suit, and there are many out there that make it a career.

It is easy to save a webpage with certain info & pricing and keep it for years, within that time frame a website owner may need to make changes that are necessary but wasn't needed say, "6 months or a year prior".



Ken I am not saying you are a dishonest person....there are still honest people in the world but one dishonest person spoils the whole bunch.

I got ripped off...within 3 days. I saw what I thought was a bargain online and did not consider it a mistake in pricing. I asked at the store for this bargain which was not in stock (supposedly?) I went back 3 times to find out it still did not come in...then I go on the web site again with almost double the price? I asked the salesperson if it was a mistake. They told me that it could be a markdown. Tomorrow they will tell me that the web site was wrong....how do I know this? They already emailed me from head office telling me to read the fine print....a real waste of my time and I thought this was a reputable company. Never having any problem before....so when is something truthful online in pricing if they say that any of their products could be a mistake in pricing?

Lets just say, I have proven once again that one cannot trust anyone's word anymore.

What if I am a Seventh Day Adventist?? What if I am a Jew.?

So Marg, as Christians we must now adapt to the world's ways? Do we really need to shop on Sunday? Do we really keep the other day that we pick out as the sabbath or do we throw out that commandment all together?

I am not a legalist, but I don't agree! If we vote for an individual and they put someone else in power, is that alright?

[Stan Hall]

"So Marg, as Christians we must now adapt to the world's ways? Do we really need to shop on Sunday? Do we really keep the other day that we pick out as the sabbath or do we throw out that commandment all together?"

Whether one needs to shop on Sunday is, I think, wide of the point. I suggest the point is the freedom for each to make his own choices. As pointed out above, Seventh Day Adventists, Seventh Day Baptists and Jews worship on Saturday. Muslims worship on Friday. Should they be required by law to abide by the beliefs of others?
If Sunday shopping is allowed that doesn't require anyone to "adapt to the world's ways." You are still free to refrain from shopping on Sunday.
(I won't go into the fact that the Old Testament Sabbath is, in fact, Saturday, not Sunday.)

[Ken Smith]

Ken I am not saying you are a dishonest person.

I didn't think you were Bob. Honestly, I don't like putting the "subject to change" statement on my site but I deal with the general public, those that have accepted Jesus and those who have not. It serves as bit of a buffer zone.


Lets just say, I have proven once again that one cannot trust anyone's word anymore.

May be too broad of a statement. Intention of the heart must be considered, in that God must give one understanding; in ourselves we do not have the ability to understand the true intent of another's heart.

*Jesus knew He would be betrayed and who would do it, yet He chose to let the Father handle the outcome. I've been ripped off more than once, and when I start trying to handle it myself instead of letting God work me thru it, I find myself not doing very well at all, I have to repeat to myself, "choose better Ken", God knew what you would be facing long before you were sent into this world. Personally that gives me a great sense of being "Free", I don't have to trust myself and no one else to take care of things, I can let God guide me and reap the benefits. Praise the Lord!!

Ken

[Bob Woolley]

I think we have lost the intent of the issue! It has nothing to do with who or who shouldn't shop on Sunday. If you re-read the post, the majority should rule. If the general public voted for No Sunday Shopping in a province wide vote and the vote was No, why should it change for two large corporations because they are greedy? This is why the people don't trust government.

Lets put it into another prespective. If I voted for Al Gore as President or even Michael S. Dukakis and "they won the election" but they were suddenly replaced with George W. Bush, wouldn't you be upset? To me that is called a dictatorship.

It seems in this day and age, no ones word or handshake is good anymore! It is gone out of style. That really is what I want to point out. At one time a handshake was all that was required...it was a man's bond. If something doesn't go the way they want it, they simply change the rules of engagement.

Today, the world is in such a state that we cannot trust in anyone or anything.

It is really an open territory for leading the world to One who everyone can trust. His Word is Truth and HE IS TRUTH!

We should be emphasing this more in our churches...because things are so unstable, unsure in the world. People are looking for security, peace in their souls.

[Barbara Moulton]

Do we really keep the other day that we pick out as the sabbath or do we throw out that commandment all together?"


My experience with the Seventh Day Adventists, is that they are FAR more serious and thoughtful about their sabbath then Christians are about Sunday.

Personally, I don't care at all if there is Sunday shopping. Forbidding people to shop on Sunday by law, does nothing to bring about a true reflection on the meaning of a day of worship and rest in their lives.

[Barbara Moulton]

[B]If you re-read the post, the majority should rule. If the general public voted for No Sunday Shopping in a province wide vote and the vote was No, why should it change for two large corporations because they are greedy?


I guess they are trying to prove a point Bob. I guarantee they WOULD not open on Sunday if nobody shopped on Sunday. People might have voted "no" on the ballot but seem to vote "yes" with their wallets.

[Bob Woolley]

Barbara you said:
People might have voted "no" on the ballot but seem to vote "yes" with their wallets.

It could be the other way round!? It seems now that they (the government) are not taking these corporations to court with a fine? Maybe a bit of more money for the political coppers, don't ya think?

Aaah, well, maybe I shouldn't thing that way but it is strange the government abandoned the idea of the fine! As I say, laws, rules or fine print can be changed to suit a need or an engagement.

The way I see it anyways! ;)

[Ken Smith]

It’s called Passing the Buck!
I think we have lost the intent of the issue!

Now it moves into the field of marketing! Since when is a price correct or incorrect? Can we trust the seller to say that the price is what is stated?
Today, this is becoming a real problem. One can post a price on the internet and then have a statement at the bottom of the page saying that the price can be changed because it was a mistake in the first place. I had that happen to me today! I find the price was incorrect and the company is not responsible for pricing mistakes online! It was my fault to have trusted that the incorrect price was displayed.

Sorry about that Bob, you've made several comments, I responded to the above, I try to leave such issues in God's hands, if He decides to give me insight then I will respond accordingly with said insight. That leaves me, "Free" from making an issue out of something I can not control.

That is not a cop out, it's trusting God and letting go of it.

Ken

[Stan Hall]

Bob, you make an interesting point. I personally feel that legislating to force others to abide by the majority's belief system is bad law. But as you argue, the people should have the right to enact laws good or bad if the majority chooses.
Rule of the majority is pure democracy. Which leads to tyranny. For an extreme example, if the majority votes to enslave the minority does that make it right?
I think freedom is better.

[Roland Hearn]

Bob,
correct me if I'm wrong but I think the point of your post wasn't about Sunday trading as much as it was about the seeming inconsistences of having a vote that says one thing and a practice that says another. Your point, I think, was to use that to say integrity, honesty and Christlike holy lives are essential in a world where people are so use to hearing one thing and seeing another. If we fall into that category in our Christian lives we have damaged our witness. I completely agree.