Will the Ark of the Covenant ever be found?

[Dave McClung]

Back when Raiders of the Lost Ark came out there was a lot of discussion about whether or not the Ark of the Covenant is still in existence. At the time, I speculated that the Ark was probably hidden and will someday be found. I once saw a "documentary" that claims that the Ark is in a synagogue in Ethiopia. Others have suggested that it is in the tunnels beneath Jerusalem that were sealed during the reign of Solomon.

In today's service at Manhattan Church of the Nazarene (also known as Lamb's Church of the Nazarene) the scripture was Jeremiah 3:15-18 which reads, "In those days, when your numbers have increased greatly in the land," declares the LORD, "men will no longer say, 'The ark of the covenant of the LORD.' It will never enter their minds or be remembered; it will not be missed, nor will another one be made."

I have read this scripture, but have always assumed that it applied to the time right after the Jews return from captivity in Babylon. This morning when I read it, the word "never" stuck out.

What do you think?

[Barb Bouldrey]

When John was in Israel, the guide said there is rumor that the Holy of Holies is located underneath what is now a Moslem Mosque built on the site of the old Temple.

Some speculated that maybe the Ark was under there.

Who knows. Who cares. Jesus makes the Ark of the Covenant void. But it would be really neat, historically and for proof of the Bible for it to be found.


Barb

[BobHunt]

You and I do not need it to be found, because we already accept and live by the teachings of Jesus. However, there are so many sceptics who say that the scriptures are not inspired and are just a bunch of writings. To them, finding the Ark of the Covenant would be significant.
I have always wondered if Noah's Ark would ever be found. Some say they have found it. It is just one more proof to those who think the Bible is just a fairy tale.
I have read some novels (Zion Chronicles by Bodie Theone) about the city of tunnels under Jerusalem, and it is so amazing! Somewhere I read about the floors under the Dome of the Rock! If it is there, maybe they wouldnt want us to know for it would just be a validation of our Christian religious system as opposed to theirs.

[Barb Bouldrey]

I love the Zion Chronicle series!

Barb

[BobHunt]

did you know that she wrote this series and also several more, even though she is dyslexic? It is amazing what impaired people can do in overcoming things!

[Brad Mercer]

I think that like pretty much every other ancient treasure, it was stripped of everything remotely valuable the second or third time it changed hands, and the rest was used as firewood. It's hard to read how they carried out one treasure after another to pay off raiders and marauders, and the temple itself was eventually leveled, and imagine a different fate for the Ark of the Covenant.

Brad

[Mark Doble]

Does the Ark not have to be placed in the new Temple?

A friend of mine whom speaks to the United Nations, on occasion, told me once that a Monk friend of his told him the Ark was in Ethiopia and that he has seen it. But would not take Mel to it for fear of death... I should have Mel tell us the whole story around it some day.
Mel is an extreamly trustworthy individual.

He was the catalyst that brought down Talisman Oil abroad. Right now he is in Darfur fighting for their cause.

I envy the life of Mel... Mel would be the Indiana Jones of today...! I could just see the two of us eh!!! :eek:

Mel and I have talked about finding the Ark. It is both our dreams to do so. :fav18

Hmmm,,,

[Regena Torres]

I have a professor who also went to Ethiopoa and said that three are guards all around the building. He believes that theya re guarding th ark.
We have no need for the ark to be found as we are belivers, however some say that the discovery of the ark will bring about the building of the temple.

[Mark Doble]

I have a professor who also went to Ethiopoa and said that three are guards all around the building. He believes that theya re guarding th ark.
We have no need for the ark to be found as we are belivers, however some say that the discovery of the ark will bring about the building of the temple.

Where in scripture does it say the Ark will be placed in the new Temple? It does mention it somewhere.

[Carmen Harrison]

When I was in Ethiopia a few months ago, I was told that Queen of Sheba (from Ethiopia) treked to Egypt to visit King Solomon. She returned to Ethiopia pregnant by King Solomon. Years later, the son of their union went to Egypt and stole the Ark. He took it to Ethiopia and hid it in Axum in one of the underground rock hewn churches. I brought back some Ethiopian Coptic Axum and Lalibela crosses from these underground churches.

Every Ethiopian I talked to is convinced that the Ark is hidden in Axum.

Carmen

[Judy Hamilton]

is it possible that God does not want another icon added to
rituals of worship..and this high profile Holy artifact will never be discovered??
a Vietnam Vet friend, a Greek Orthodox Christian opened two of their churches to me when i visited them in 2005. In the first one i was allowed to photograph a baptismal of a small boy. This religion as well as the Ukrainian Orthodox, Catholic and one another Church in the photos below churches are seeped in rituals and Icons..as i mentioned the worship of Icons for some Christians almost clouds the meaning of the Sacrificial Lamb

first three ..Greek Orthodox
photo four...Catholic

photo five..Episcopal

photo six...Catholic..this was a lovely ceiling motif, in this Cathedral..however lost its meaning for this protestant



http://heyjude.smugmug.com/gallery/782338

[Mark Doble]

When I was in Ethiopia a few months ago, I was told that Queen of Sheba (from Ethiopia) treked to Egypt to visit King Solomon. She returned to Ethiopia pregnant by King Solomon. Years later, the son of their union went to Egypt and stole the Ark. He took it to Ethiopia and hid it in Axum in one of the underground rock hewn churches. I brought back some Ethiopian Coptic Axum and Lalibela crosses from these underground churches.

Every Ethiopian I talked to is convinced that the Ark is hidden in Axum.

Carmen

So why don't we just go to Axum and get it?

[Cindi Hammons]

Because it doesn't belong to us...and the Ethiopians do not want to give it away.

That is...if it is even there.

[Mark Doble]

Because it doesn't belong to us...and the Ethiopians do not want to give it away.

That is...if it is even there.

Somewhere in Revelation is says it must be returned to the new Temple. So we could just return it...

[Billy Cox]

What I hear in the scripture is that the worship of God can continue even in the absence of the ark. I don't think it has any bearing on whether the ark still exists somewhere.

I wonder what (if anything) it would mean if the ark was discovered and found to be authentic.

[Belinda Y. Edwards]

Jeremiah 3:15-18 which reads, "In those days, when your numbers have increased greatly in the land," declares the LORD, "men will no longer say, 'The ark of the covenant of the LORD.' It will never enter their minds or be remembered; it will not be missed, nor will another one be made."

I have read this scripture, but have always assumed that it applied to the time right after the Jews return from captivity in Babylon. This morning when I read it, the word "never" stuck out.

What do you think?



i honestly don't know what to think about the scriptural part that says the ark will never be remembered, missed, remade - -

Very interesting -

Dave, how can this scripture be true, when we have people who still speak about it? Is scripture ever wrong? Am i reading this wrong? Is this scripture speaking of the Israelites' response to the Ark?

[Mark Doble]

What I hear in the scripture is that the worship of God can continue even in the absence of the ark. I don't think it has any bearing on whether the ark still exists somewhere.

I wonder what (if anything) it would mean if the ark was discovered and found to be authentic.

My point is Billy, somewhere in Revelation it states that the Ark will be found and placed in the center of the new Temple. So in fact, it still does exist and will be found. The Ark is not lost, the guardians of the Ark know where it is and are bound by death to keep it hidden until the appointed time, no matter what.

[Gord Evans]

My point is Billy, somewhere in Revelation it states that the Ark will be found and placed in the center of the new Temple. So in fact, it still does exist and will be found. The Ark is not lost, the guardians of the Ark know where it is and are bound by death to keep it hidden until the appointed time, no matter what.


I'm not sure that is what the Scripture in Revelation is saying. Remember that the Book of Revelation is (1) apocalyptic writing, and loaded with imagery, and, (2) all about the Revelation of Jesus Christ to John (and ultimately to us, through His inspired word).

Clearly, from this book, Jesus Christ is Lord and ruler over everyone and everything, even powerful human governments. He is clearly in control and will someday judge and punish what is evil, even Satan. He will also establish an everlasting kingdom with a new heaven and a new earth.

He will return, again ... soon. And the new Jerusalem (according to Rev. 21:2) will come down to us, and (Rev. 21:3) God will dwell with us. When we see Christ arriving, we'll go out to meet Him, but we're not going anywhere ... He's coming back to us!

In this Book of Revelation, as part of Christ's "revelation" of Himself to the Apostle John, he opened up heaven to him, and let him have a look.

Revelation 11:19 says, "Then God's temple in heaven was opened, and within his temple was seen the ark of his covenant. And there came flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder, an earthquake and a great hailstorm."

Ever since His incarnation, death and resurrection, Christ is God's (new) covenant with His people. As Christ opened up heaven for John to have a look, He revealled Himself within the temple ... He is "the ark of his covenant", revealed in all His glory to John. This has nothing to do with the OT man-made replica-creation and earthly representation of God's dwelling place which is now rightly "missing".

And, absolutely unnecessary.

Christ is the new covenant. He is all we need.

Who knows? Maybe someone will discover and reveal (what will be believed to be) Noah's ark, and the man-made wooden and gold ark that has gone missing. But who cares.

Just give me Jesus!

[Dennis Bratcher]

[QUOTE=Dave McClung;59647]Back when Raiders of the Lost Ark came out there was a lot of discussion about whether or not the Ark of the Covenant is still in existence. At the time, I speculated that the Ark was probably hidden and will someday be found. I once saw a "documentary" that claims that the Ark is in a synagogue in Ethiopia. Others have suggested that it is in the tunnels beneath Jerusalem that were sealed during the reign of Solomon.

In today's service at Manhattan Church of the Nazarene (also known as Lamb's Church of the Nazarene) the scripture was Jeremiah 3:15-18 which reads, "In those days, when your numbers have increased greatly in the land," declares the LORD, "men will no longer say, 'The ark of the covenant of the LORD.' It will never enter their minds or be remembered; it will not be missed, nor will another one be made."

I have read this scripture, but have always assumed that it applied to the time right after the Jews return from captivity in Babylon. This morning when I read it, the word "never" stuck out.

In reference to the biblical text, there is not a corresponding word "never" in the biblical text. There is simply a series of repeated negatives: it will not come upon the heart; they will not remember it; they will not miss ; it will not be made again. The negative used here ([I]lo') is emphatic and is used in imperatives as a permanant prohibition. But these are not imperatives, so it remains an emphatic negative, "definately not," without necessarly implying "never."

Grace and Peace

Dennis B.

[Dennis Bratcher]

[QUOTE=Judy Hamilton;59887]..as i mentioned the worship of Icons for some Christians almost clouds the meaning of the Sacrificial Lamb.

Just a point of clarification. Neither Catholics nor Orthodox worship icons or saints. The term is veneration, which they are very careful not to equate to worship.

"In traditional Christian Churches of Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy, veneration (Latin veneratio, Greek δουλια dulia), or veneration of saints, is a special act of honoring a dead person who has been identified as singular in the traditions of the religion, and through them honoring God who made them and in whose image they are made. Veneration is often shown outwardly by respectfully bowing or making the sign of the cross before a saint's icon, relics, or statue. These items may also be kissed. In Catholic and Orthodox theology, veneration is a type of honor distinct from the worship due to God alone. Church theologians have long adopted the terms latria for the sacrificial worship due to God alone, and dulia for the veneration given to saints and icons." (from Wickipedia)

Grace and peace,

Dennis B.

[Cindi Hammons]

Thanks Dennis. I did not know that and always thought the Orthodox and Catholics prayed to saints and icons.

Good information.

[Dennis Bratcher]

Thanks Dennis. I did not know that and always thought the Orthodox and Catholics prayed to saints and icons.

Good information.

Well, you are partially right. They do pray to the saints, but not thinking that the saints actually answer the prayers themselves. The belief is that the saints intercede with God on their behalf (see below).

I had an interesting experience in Moscow a few years ago. I was visiting a restored Russian Orthodox prayer chapel at the edge of Red Square (Stalin had converted it into a public latrine). Typically Orthodox, the walls of the chapel were covered with icons. As I was admiring the art, I noticed a woman, easily in her mid-80s, stooped over and with great effort going around the chapel. She paused before each icon and kissed it, while obviously praying. My first thought was how sad it was that she did not know any better way to pray than to pray to an icon.

God has an interesting way of dealing with us at such times. I don’t hear from God directly that often but this was one of those times. God reminded me that this woman had lived her entire life under an oppressive communist government that denied even the existence of God. And yet here she was expressing her love and devotion to God in the only way that she knew how. The message from God was “leave her alone; she is my child.”

I’m still learning how to be authentically Christian amid all my prejudices. I don't pray to saints or icons, since as a Protestant I believe we have immediate access to God. But fortunately for us all, God is bigger than my ideas about him.

[Again, from Wickipedia] It is important to note that Saints are not "worshipped" according to strict Christian terminology. Worship is reserved for God alone, whereas Saints are venerated (see veneration), respected, and viewed as role models. . . . In Roman Catholic theology [as well as Eastern Orthodox], since God is the God of the Living, then it follows that the saints are alive in Heaven. As "special friends of God," they can be asked to intercede or pray for those still on earth. A Saint may be designated as a Patron saint of particular causes or professions, or invoked against specific illnesses or disasters. They are not thought to have power of their own, but only that granted by God. Relics of Saints are respected in a similar manner to holy images and icons of Saints.
Grace and Peace,

Dennis B.