WOMEN! I still don't understand them.

[Michael B. Ross]

I finally convinced my wife to hire someone to clean our house. She and I are so busy, we don't have the time and/or energy to tackle routine house cleaning. So, every two weeks someone comes to the house and dusts, vacuums etc.

This morning my wife came to my upstairs in-home office to kiss me goodbye. When she left, she said: "I need to go downstairs and clean up a little. The cleaning person is coming today."

I honestly do not understand why someone would clean the house because the house cleaner is coming.

[Gary Swartzlander]

For the same reason that someone has to make sure that the dishwasher is empty and there isn't even one dirty dish in the sink when we leave for 2 weeks vacation.

[Cecil Wallace]

I honestly do not understand why someone would clean the house because the house cleaner is coming.
Michael!
Don't even try.
Although they are beautiful & wonderful, there's just no way to figure them out.
But it is fun trying, isn't it?
:basic05

[Mark Doble]

I finally convinced my wife to hire someone to clean our house. She and I are so busy, we don't have the time and/or energy to tackle routine house cleaning. So, every two weeks someone comes to the house and dusts, vacuums etc.

This morning my wife came to my upstairs in-home office to kiss me goodbye. When she left, she said: "I need to go downstairs and clean up a little. The cleaning person is coming today."

I honestly do not understand why someone would clean the house because the house cleaner is coming.

Actually it is very simple Michael... :basic05

Women take the cleanliness of their house seriously K. So before the cleaning lady sees the mess, it must be clean! It is a pride thing... Not a guy thing:::

A couple of years ago my wife was in a car accident. It was very painful for her to do anything. SHE WOULD NOT allow the Ins. company to send in someone to help her out to clean ect... Drove me nuts man!:eek:

[Alisa Stoll]

Now for the expert's point of view (ie another female) - the cleaning company does the basics - vacuming, dusting, etc. - they don't and can't take care of "clutter" where does the magazine on the counter go? In order for them to do a good job on the basics, the clutter needs to be taken care of. Or as someone alluded to, if they are to clean the sink - the dishes need to be cleaned first. You could say that they could clean the dishes but they don't know where to put them afterwards and do you really want them going through trying to figure that out? Believe me - most women won't do the actual jobs that they are paying someone else to do!

Alisa

[Billie Goodson]

See...only a woman would even try to explain it.

[Mark Doble]

Now for the expert's point of view (ie another female) - the cleaning company does the basics - vacuming, dusting, etc. - they don't and can't take care of "clutter" where does the magazine on the counter go? In order for them to do a good job on the basics, the clutter needs to be taken care of. Or as someone alluded to, if they are to clean the sink - the dishes need to be cleaned first. You could say that they could clean the dishes but they don't know where to put them afterwards and do you really want them going through trying to figure that out? Believe me - most women won't do the actual jobs that they are paying someone else to do!

Alisa

Hu?

There goes my theory!

I'll be 305 when I understand the female gender...

Sorry Michael :basic04

[JD Sherrow]

This is the conversation my son had with my 10-year-old grandson, Drew.

On the way home from school he said, “Dad, girls are a mystery. Why don’t they reveal their secrets?”

I told him to tell Drew that if they ever do call Grandpa first.

[Anita F. Henck]

Two different topics, two different answers!

Michael --
Some men (you and my husband, for example), see hiring someone to work for you as a task. You choose a service provider, agree on a project and fee, they come and do the work, and you pay them.

Some women (I and maybe your wife), see hiring someone as a relationship. We choose someone to work for us that we like and trust, we know that better service comes from better choices of staff, and we want them to do well for us so we do well for them. There is also Part B of this relationship (which I'm now revealing a secret known only to women until now) ... we don't want them to see how dirty things really are and be embarrassed. Again, the relationship part means that we CARE what they think of us.


Gary--
The thing of leaving dishes clean and the dishwasher unloaded is something different for me (and maybe for your wife). When you vacation, stay in nice hotels, and have everything cleaned every day, it is at least nice to sit in the car or the plane returning home and know that you're walking into a place that, at least for the first 15 minutes in the house, is going to look nice!

Besides, can you imagine the odor and the growth of stuff on dishes that sat unwashed in the dishwasher for two weeks? Yuk! :)

[Barbara Moulton]

I honestly do not understand why someone would clean the house because the house cleaner is coming.


Let's say you were leaving one job for another. Before the person came to take over, wouldn't you get all the files in order and make sure everything was ready for them to do the job?

You wouldn't leave your office and desk a mess. You wouldn't leave personal notes for them to see.

Part of it is respect for them, the other part is not wanting the person who follows you to think you are a slob. And this is when it comes to a person that you will never need to see again or work with.

When it comes to my home, although I have never had a cleaner, I would want to make sure that things were in order for them to do the job. This is a person who is going to be coming to my home on a regular basis. I would want things to be generally "tidy and organized" so that they could clean. And yes, I would want to make sure that there were no confidential items lying around.

In our day to day living, most of us let our standards slide in some area of the house on occasion. Our families love us...they don't think less of us. For example, I did the grocery shopping on Monday night, but, because I had a tiring day with some medical tests, I told Carl I would sort everything out the next day. I put the persishables away but left everything else out on the counter.

Carl understood.

But if I had someone coming to clean my house the next morning, I would not have done that. First, because it would be hard for them to clean the kitchen in that state and second, because he/she might make a judgement about me :-)

And yes...everything is all put away now.

[Mark Doble]

O my...

[William Hunter]

Mike, after 32 plus years of ministry, a Masters in Pastoral Counseling, five years as a referral counselor for Focus On the Family, 5 plus yrs. as a Clinical Chaplain in the VA where I counseled vets with PTSD and their families, I have come to this conclusion---women do not understand women!!!

Now, if you will excuse me, I am going to duck and run for cover.






I finally convinced my wife to hire someone to clean our house. She and I are so busy, we don't have the time and/or energy to tackle routine house cleaning. So, every two weeks someone comes to the house and dusts, vacuums etc.

This morning my wife came to my upstairs in-home office to kiss me goodbye. When she left, she said: "I need to go downstairs and clean up a little. The cleaning person is coming today."

I honestly do not understand why someone would clean the house because the house cleaner is coming.

[Barbara Moulton]

Mike, after 32 plus years of ministry, a Masters in Pastoral Counseling, five years as a referral counselor for Focus On the Family, 5 plus yrs. as a Clinical Chaplain in the VA where I counseled vets with PTSD and their families, I have come to this conclusion---women do not understand women!!!

Now, if you will excuse me, I am going to duck and run for cover.

I think people don't always understand people period, regardless of gender.

[Jim Franklin]

Give up, they are beyond human male comprehension. Some say that they are aliens from Venus which will always be strange to the men who favor Mars bars. They can be tricky according to Father Adam and try to get us to do things we are not supposed to do. Same reason why I was not allowed to date until I was 18. From a much older old geezer, your social commentator.

[Barbara Moulton]

They can be tricky according to Father Adam and try to get us to do things we are not supposed to do. Same reason why I was not allowed to date until I was 18.

Ah yes...the woman as temptress. I've heard that before. Men are moral creatures, it is the female that lures him into sin. You poor guys. You'd be much better off without us right?

To tell the truth, although the thread is meant to be humourous, there is an underlying assumption that bothers me a bit. If men and women simply dismiss the other sex as "incomprehensible" then our relationships will not be as healthy as they could be.

Women themselves joke with each other about cleaning the house before the cleaning woman arrive. On the surface it seems a little silly but if you take the time to consider it, you realize that it is no different than a man tidying up a workspace that he either has to turn over to someone else or share with someone else.

In other words, if we all would just take the time to think about what the other person needs, we should be able to figure out why they need it. Then, if we love the other person, we can try to meet that need (even if it isn't a need that we ourselves have).

Women are not complicated. We want the following from the men in our lives:

Spiritual companionship.
Personal affirmation.
Personal affection.
Meaningful conversation.
Openess and honesty.
Security.
Committment to family.

While some of these things don't rank as high for men, if most men think about the woman in their life they should be able to figure out why these things are important to her, how she communicates these needs and what he can do to meet them.

Edited to add: My husband often notes in our "Building Better Marraiges" seminars that if a man really takes the time to meet the top needs of their wife, they will find it far more likely that she will be willing to meet his top needs.

[Hans Deventer]

Edited to add: My husband often notes in our "Building Better Marraiges" seminars that if a man really takes the time to meet the top needs of their wife, they will find it far more likely that she will be willing to meet his top needs.

I think Carl is right, though I readily admit that marriage makes the collection of data a little too limited to call it scientific.

[Bob Evans]

I don't know weather its culture or genetics but I think woman take greater pride in the condition fo their home than men do.

Ozzie sat on the couch and read the paper because he got his strokes from out side the house at work and Harriet got her strokes form home because she stayed at home. These were fairly normal cultural roles in the 50s and
60s. So in that regards I say it's cultural.

But it can't be all cultural. Because with women entering the out side the home work force it's still the case. At least it is at my house.

I have been working for 27 years to convince my wife that there is a difference between dirt and mess. I loose more than I win

[Barbara Moulton]

I don't know weather its culture or genetics but I think woman take greater pride in the condition fo their home than men do.


Generally speaking I would agree.

[Mark Doble]

Ah yes...the woman as temptress. I've heard that before. Men are moral creatures, it is the female that lures him into sin. You poor guys. You'd be much better off without us right?

To tell the truth, although the thread is meant to be humourous, there is an underlying assumption that bothers me a bit. If men and women simply dismiss the other sex as "incomprehensible" then our relationships will not be as healthy as they could be.

Women themselves joke with each other about cleaning the house before the cleaning woman arrive. On the surface it seems a little silly but if you take the time to consider it, you realize that it is no different than a man tidying up a workspace that he either has to turn over to someone else or share with someone else.

In other words, if we all would just take the time to think about what the other person needs, we should be able to figure out why they need it. Then, if we love the other person, we can try to meet that need (even if it isn't a need that we ourselves have).

Women are not complicated. We want the following from the men in our lives:

Spiritual companionship.
Personal affirmation.
Personal affection.
Meaningful conversation.
Openess and honesty.
Security.
Committment to family.

While some of these things don't rank as high for men, if most men think about the woman in their life they should be able to figure out why these things are important to her, how she communicates these needs and what he can do to meet them.

Edited to add: My husband often notes in our "Building Better Marraiges" seminars that if a man really takes the time to meet the top needs of their wife, they will find it far more likely that she will be willing to meet his top needs.

So lets hear from the GUYS K... What is it that we need in a marriage relationship?
In order of importance please....

NO, I am not going first. :basic02

[Hans Deventer]

So lets hear from the GUYS K... What is it that we need in a marriage relationship? In order of importance please....

Love would be too obvious an answer, I guess. If would of course be #1.
I like how Barbara made it more specific.

1. Acceptance. I think it goes without saying that you can never have a good relationship if the basis for that relationship is not accepting the other for who (s)he is. Without it, there is no safety, no home (you're never good enough). This includes Barbara's "security". And for me, probably the strongest language in which this acceptance can be phrased is sexuality. I might not be the only guy who feels that way :basic01

2. Spiritual companionship. To be able to share my faith and my struggles is very important. It has to do with #1 of course, but it goes further. It is great to be fellow pilgrims. Again referring to Barbara's list, I would say this includes "Meaningful conversation" and "Openess and honesty". There can be no true companionship without those.

The more I think about it, the more I feel even the distinction between #1 and #2 is artificial, though I do realize that some people can have a great marriage with an unbelieving partner. I don't think I could, however. So for me, it really all boils down to love and acceptance. Of course, according to the famous "Five Languages Of Love" (http://www.fivelovelanguages.com/) book, there will, be differences in priorities of those five. I think that's where generally the main differences between men and women are, in the priorities. Understanding there will always be exceptions to the rule.

[Barbara Moulton]

Love would be too obvious an answer, I guess. If would of course be #1.
I like how Barbara made it more specific.

1. Acceptance. I think it goes without saying that you can never have a good relationship if the basis for that relationship is not accepting the other for who (s)he is. Without it, there is no safety, no home (you're never good enough). This includes Barbara's "security". And for me, probably the strongest language in which this acceptance can be phrased is sexuality. I might not be the only guy who feels that way :basic01


That's where the reciprocity comes in of course. If a woman feels that a man is meeting her needs, she will be more willing to meet this very important need in his life. And vice versa.

And you have zeroed in on something that many women don't understand. How important the sexual act is for most men, in feeling accepted and affirmed by their wives. They need to understand what it does to their hsuband, when there is constant rejection.

Similiarly, what we then try to communicate with the men is that the way they feel if their wife continually rejects their overtures of sex is the way a wife feels when she her husband never sits and talks with her with openess and honesty, or never demonstrates affection.

Of course, the biggest problem in marriages is when one spouse says, "I am not going to worry about meeting his/her most important needs until she/he starts meeting mine." Then we simply have an impasse.

It has to start with one person and hopefully the other will respond positively.

It's not impossible to understand the opposite sex. But it isn't a walk in the park either.

But it's worth the effort for a healthy marriage.

[Hans Deventer]

Similarly, what we then try to communicate with the men is that the way they feel if their wife continually rejects their overtures of sex is the way a wife feels when she her husband never sits and talks with her with openness and honesty, or never demonstrates affection.

It seems there is also a difference in talking. I understand guys in general (and certainly me) are very goal oriented. "There's a problem? Okay, let's find a solution." While for women, at least part of the solution seems to be in the talking itself. Probably because it brings that same feeling of acceptance that we all long for (towards God as well, of course).

[William Hunter]

One day Adam and his boys were out for a walk and came by the edge of a beautiful garden in which was all the food they could eat, and all other things to support life without much work. One of the boys said to Adam, "Dad, why don't we live in there?" To which Adam replied: "Son, we did, but your mother ate us out of house and home."






Give up, they are beyond human male comprehension. Some say that they are aliens from Venus which will always be strange to the men who favor Mars bars. They can be tricky according to Father Adam and try to get us to do things we are not supposed to do. Same reason why I was not allowed to date until I was 18. From a much older old geezer, your social commentator.

[Jim Franklin]

If she is so self-sufficient and claims perfection that she rejects the idea of having any "needs" then how does a man try to meet her needs if she refuses to accept even the idea that there might be needs.

[Hans Deventer]

If she is so self-sufficient and claims perfection that she rejects the idea of having any "needs" then how does a man try to meet her needs if she refuses to accept even the idea that there might be needs.

You can't. But of course the thinking here applies to healthy people, mentally. The one you describe isn't.

[Barbara Moulton]

You can't. But of course the thinking here applies to healthy people, mentally. The one you describe isn't.

Of course.

When we conduct marriage seminars, BOTH husband and wife are there....wanting their marriage to get better.