Faith Mentoring in the 21st Century

[Bob Hunter]

Faith mentoring has been a topic of great interest to me over the last few years. I am actively involved in a handful of mentoring partnerships with other men and I find these relationships very fulfilling. The early Wesleyans championed the cause of twin souls or mentoring pairs. Wesley put pairs together to help each other as "soul friends" or "spiritual friends".

I recently spoke with Tom Nees with regards to mentoring. He is part of an organization that helps equip and train people to mentor. Although, he is more directly involved in clergy mentoring which is a big need in our denomination. He writes an excellent article on mentoring found here: http://leadingtoserve.com/?p=376

Tom asks a very simple question: Are you mentoring and are you being mentored?

Many claim to have "mentors" but few can describe the mentoring process formally speaking. In other words, formal mentoring requires upfront agreement, disciplined conversation and the pursuit of intentional goals.

[Susan Unger]

I am very glad to have finally found a spiritual friend - her prayer life, personality and even height are the same as mine. And she goes to my church which is like the cherry on the top of a great sundae

[Hans Deventer]

I answered option #4, I don't technically visit Sunday School but I presume the Bible Study group that I lead will qualify as such. Of course we discuss life issues there as well, but it isn't anything like mentoring and I would not consider it a spiritual friendship where I can discuss what is really in my heart.

The good thing is that I do have this within my marriage.

[Jean Johnson]

I teach an English Bible class for our Chinese congregation. The other Sunday we had a lesson on Timothy, and at the conclusion of the lesson I urged the mature Christians to find someone to mentor and the new Christians to be good "learners" as was Timothy. At the end of class, two of the Chinese women, who happened to be sisters, excitedly approached me, saying that they would like for me to mentor them. I was surprised, but told them I would think and pray about it. Later, I decided I would like to do this. I believe both of then have been baptized into the Christian faith, but I have the feeling that they probably don't know much about Jesus or scriptures. I indicated that I could start from the beginning of the new year. I'm not sure if they mostly want mentoring in spiritual matters or want English....or maybe both. Ideally, it probably would be better for them to be mentored in their "mother" tongue. However, I'll see how the Lord leads us.

[Cam Pence]

I went with the 3rd option. I lead a weekly Bible study and have seminary friends I meet with on a fairly regular basis (when I can get to Kansas City). I am on the eastern fringes of the Kansas City district so I am pretty spread out from other pastors, so it is a bit hard to connect with other pastors on a regular basis. Would be nice to find a way to be mentored by some of the people who have done this much longer than me on a regular basis though for sure.

[Bob Hunter]

I answered option #4, I don't technically visit Sunday School but I presume the Bible Study group that I lead will qualify as such. Of course we discuss life issues there as well, but it isn't anything like mentoring and I would not consider it a spiritual friendship where I can discuss what is really in my heart.

The good thing is that I do have this within my marriage.

Yeah, in the Bible College I teach we require each student to develop a spiritual friendship and we insist that it may not be your spouse or an opposite sex individual. There are a lot of reasons for that, but it is written in the syllabus. We need to be disciplined outside of our marriages to actively listen, prayerfully engage and help others pursue their spiritual and professional goals.

I am often surprised by the number of students who cannot identify a person with whom they can meet with on a regular basis to discuss spiritual matters. There are many things that I discuss with my "bro's" that I do not find helpful to discuss with my wife because it would not build her up or benefit her in any way. So there is great wisdom in having these discussions outside of marriage.

I do think you would be a great mentor Hans. I have said that before, I will say it again. You have a lot of wisdom to share and you very good expressing spiritual ideas. Besides, you are a great husband and that makes for a great mentor to men who need to develop such qualities.

[Marsha Lynn]

From my point of view, I do have mentors. By your definition, I do not.

By your definition (and that of almost anyone who defines the term), the only way to be mentored is to find someone who will accept a formal role as mentor. And the only way to be a mentor is to set up a formal relationship with someone who commits to regular meetings and forms of accountability. I have no such relationships. The people who teach me the most have no clue how much impact they have on me. I can only hope and pray that I can bring that much blessing into the lives of others as I go through my days.

Marsha

[Susan Unger]

From my point of view, I do have mentors. By your definition, I do not.

By your definition (and that of almost anyone who defines the term), the only way to be mentored is to find someone who will accept a formal role as mentor. And the only way to be a mentor is to set up a formal relationship with someone who commits to regular meetings and forms of accountability. I have no such relationships. The people who teach me the most have no clue how much impact they have on me. I can only hope and pray that I can bring that much blessing into the lives of others as I go through my days.

Marsha

That's why I didn't put down mentors either. People influence me and I influence others but not in a formal way.

[Paul DeBaufer]

From my point of view, I do have mentors. By your definition, I do not.

By your definition (and that of almost anyone who defines the term), the only way to be mentored is to find someone who will accept a formal role as mentor. And the only way to be a mentor is to set up a formal relationship with someone who commits to regular meetings and forms of accountability. I have no such relationships. The people who teach me the most have no clue how much impact they have on me. I can only hope and pray that I can bring that much blessing into the lives of others as I go through my days.

Marsha

This is a form of mentorship, I am sure

[Paul DeBaufer]

I clicked the first 3, as this is a multiple choice poll.

I meet with both of my pastors (I am bi-congregational) each week. It is not a formal mentoring session, but works. I am a leader and counselor in a Christian recovery program so I mentor others. I also have two small groups, one where I am the "leader", facilitator seems better. We have become very close and confess to one another things we may not to anyone else. The other where I am just a participant. Relationships of a spiritual nature form in these settings.

[Cam Pence]

From my point of view, I do have mentors. By your definition, I do not.

By your definition (and that of almost anyone who defines the term), the only way to be mentored is to find someone who will accept a formal role as mentor. And the only way to be a mentor is to set up a formal relationship with someone who commits to regular meetings and forms of accountability. I have no such relationships. The people who teach me the most have no clue how much impact they have on me. I can only hope and pray that I can bring that much blessing into the lives of others as I go through my days.

Marsha

I wouldn't count that out of the realm of mentor ship by a long shot

[Hans Deventer]

I am often surprised by the number of students who cannot identify a person with whom they can meet with on a regular basis to discuss spiritual matters. There are many things that I discuss with my "bro's" that I do not find helpful to discuss with my wife because it would not build her up or benefit her in any way. So there is great wisdom in having these discussions outside of marriage.

I can't think of one subject in my spiritual life that I cannot or should not discuss with my wife, or think unhelpful. That may be a reason why I've not looked all that hard for someone else.
You made me think though. And come to think of it, before Hannie and I got married, I used to have my best talks with women too, including Hannie. In fact, we started dating because we could talk so well! Of course, the contact with other women stopped when Hannie and I started dating seriously.

[Greg Farra]

I am in a formal mentorship as part of my educational requirements.
I also meet 'informally' with a pastor my age that is mutually edifying.
I lead our community group as well, so I guess I'm being mentored and doing some as well.
Sadly, I had a year-long mentorship with a young man that left our church and is away from any healthy spiritual relationship.

[Bob Hunter]

I can't think of one subject in my spiritual life that I cannot or should not discuss with my wife, or think unhelpful. That may be a reason why I've not looked all that hard for someone else.
You made me think though. And come to think of it, before Hannie and I got married, I used to have my best talks with women too, including Hannie. In fact, we started dating because we could talk so well! Of course, the contact with other women stopped when Hannie and I started dating seriously.

Sometimes men divulge certain issues to one another that really don't need to be discussed anywhere else because it would not be helpful. My wife agrees that it is not helpful and doesn't even bother to ask.

[Bob Hunter]

From my point of view, I do have mentors. By your definition, I do not.

By your definition (and that of almost anyone who defines the term), the only way to be mentored is to find someone who will accept a formal role as mentor. And the only way to be a mentor is to set up a formal relationship with someone who commits to regular meetings and forms of accountability. I have no such relationships. The people who teach me the most have no clue how much impact they have on me. I can only hope and pray that I can bring that much blessing into the lives of others as I go through my days.

Marsha

Informal mentoring can take place in a small group, S.S. class or through various forms of Christian ministry. I would not by any means discourage it. It can be helpful and contribute to our spiritual well being. I would like to suggest other possibilities. What did Wesley have in mind when he encouraged the development of soul friends? Was it informal or formal? It seems to me it was formal. But I am open to input on this from someone who might know more about Wesleyan spirituality than myself.

Tom Nees has held a number of workshops on mentoring and he says most folks in attendance are most familiar with informal mentoring. He encourages participants to explore mentoring as an intentional and deliberative act that requires disciplined conversations and commitment. It is easy for a mentoring partnership to unravel into a mere friendship or fellowship gathering and not yield a fruitful results.

Like you, I had no such relationship with a mentor which is why I decided to rewrite the script eight years ago and start the journey. I began to mentor men in my Church who were new Christians and the journey began. I have been blessed with numerous times by the way in which these men minister back to me. A healthy mentoring partnership should be mutually beneficial. So I have been mentored in reverse! By my mentees! Praise God!

[Hans Deventer]

Sometimes men divulge certain issues to one another that really don't need to be discussed anywhere else because it would not be helpful. My wife agrees that it is not helpful and doesn't even bother to ask.

Bob, I understand why my wife isn't interested in discussing classic cars and similar topics. However, what kind of topic related to one's spiritual life can one discuss with men, but not with women? Serious question, I honestly have no idea.

Btw, I so agree this is an important topic.

[Susan Unger]

Bob, I understand why my wife isn't interested in discussing classic cars and similar topics. However, what kind of topic related to one's spiritual life can one discuss with men, but not with women? Serious question, I honestly have no idea.

Btw, I so agree this is an important topic.

I admit that I am curious, too. I've been reviewing in my mind the spiritual discussions I've had with women and those with men trying to see if any of those conversations would be women only appropriate. I can't think of any, other than there one or two men who think if I have brought up a subject it is because I want to be fixed or want advice - which annoys me to no end.

[Paul DeBaufer]

I admit that I am curious, too. I've been reviewing in my mind the spiritual discussions I've had with women and those with men trying to see if any of those conversations would be women only appropriate. I can't think of any, other than there one or two men who think if I have brought up a subject it is because I want to be fixed or want advice - which annoys me to no end.

Men are fixers. They hear what they perceive as a problem and they want to fix it. And out comes the "solution" oft without hearing the whole context. We have to work hard at just listening without offering a fix. Some just can't do it.

[Susan Unger]

Men are fixers. They hear what they perceive as a problem and they want to fix it. And out comes the "solution" oft without hearing the whole context. We have to work hard at just listening without offering a fix. Some just can't do it.

Yeah, I know that some are like that. One in particular is REALLY REALLY BAD about it [and he is so blind to it]. I avoid him like the plague. But, I have had some great spiritual discussions with other men who never come across as fixing me.

[Bob Hunter]

Bob, I understand why my wife isn't interested in discussing classic cars and similar topics. However, what kind of topic related to one's spiritual life can one discuss with men, but not with women? Serious question, I honestly have no idea.

Btw, I so agree this is an important topic.

I'm glad you asked. I can only answer based on my experience. There are times when a conversation will lead to a sensitive topic such as annoying habit, quirk or behavior. We all have habits and hang-ups that make us feel a bit self-conscious. When these matters are discussed in private conversation with a mentor, I just don't see the need for it to go any further. I don't share issues of that nature with my wife much less confidential matters like a past suicide attempt. It is not helpful to her or the person I am mentoring. Just this week a mentee shared some past issues with me that were quite disturbing and unsettling. And even though my wife is incredibly understanding and insightful, she does not need to be burdened with it and I do not feel right revealing it to her when it was shared in confidence. So I just leave it well enough alone. This is particularly true when it involves a sexual matter such as a porn habit. I used to tell my wife all this stuff, I don't anymore, she has heard it all though. I don't want her to have it on her mind when she may see this individual at a worship service or in the community. I offer general information like, "So and so is having some male struggles..." She just nods and moves onto the next topic.

[Bob Hunter]

I am in a formal mentorship as part of my educational requirements.
I also meet 'informally' with a pastor my age that is mutually edifying.
I lead our community group as well, so I guess I'm being mentored and doing some as well.
Sadly, I had a year-long mentorship with a young man that left our church and is away from any healthy spiritual relationship.

Greg,

A couple of the guys I mentored as a pastor are not doing very well spiritually. It saddens me, but I know that I gave them everything I could in the way of help.

I applaud your efforts, don't give up!

[Hans Deventer]

I'm glad you asked. I can only answer based on my experience. There are times when a conversation will lead to a sensitive topic such as annoying habit, quirk or behavior. We all have habits and hang-ups that make us feel a bit self-conscious. When these matters are discussed in private conversation with a mentor, I just don't see the need for it to go any further. I don't share issues of that nature with my wife much less confidential matters like a past suicide attempt. It is not helpful to her or the person I am mentoring. Just this week a mentee shared some past issues with me that were quite disturbing and unsettling. And even though my wife is incredibly understanding and insightful, she does not need to be burdened with it and I do not feel right revealing it to her when it was shared in confidence. So I just leave it well enough alone. This is particularly true when it involves a sexual matter such as a porn habit. I used to tell my wife all this stuff, I don't anymore, she has heard it all though. I don't want her to have it on her mind when she may see this individual at a worship service or in the community. I offer general information like, "So and so is having some male struggles..." She just nods and moves onto the next topic.

Ah! But that is not what I meant. I meant, what spiritual issues regarding YOURSELF can't you share with your wife? It's clear that you don't share stuff of OTHERS that was told you confidentially.

You suggested there are things you could share with a guy, but not with your wife. Or am I misunderstanding you? That could be.

[Marsha Lynn]

Ah! But that is not what I meant. I meant, what spiritual issues regarding YOURSELF can't you share with your wife? It's clear that you don't share stuff of OTHERS that was told you confidentially.

You suggested there are things you could share with a guy, but not with your wife. Or am I misunderstanding you? That could be.

I thought he was headed there, Hans.

I can only answer based on my experience. There are times when a conversation will lead to a sensitive topic such as annoying habit, quirk or behavior. We all have habits and hang-ups that make us feel a bit self-conscious...

Sometimes within a marriage -- not your marriage apparently, but some marriages -- certain topics can become sensitive issues that are difficult to discuss. Or maybe one's spouse has bought into a particular perspective and can't see past that one point of view. Certain topics may trigger a predictable but less-than-helpful response.

I find that it's sometimes good to get a fresh perspective on things from someone who isn't so close to the situation within which you find yourself. Of course, if you commit yourself to a formal relationship with a single mentor, you can run into similar problems. You get only the one viewpoint. I guess if you can find someone you consider able to give wise and objective counsel in all areas, that will work. Personally, I haven't found that one source of consistently wise and unprejudiced advice.

Sometimes the best perspective I find on a topic comes from a child and I am knocked over by the simplicity and obvious nature of their innocent insight which they present with such refreshing honesty. That doesn't mean I want to go to that child for advice on every topic, but I would also be vastly poorer to pass over such serendipitous "mentoring."

Marsha

[Hans Deventer]

I thought he was headed there, Hans.

I initially thought so too, but it seems it is mostly (or completely) about information gathered during a talk with a mentee. Perhaps I am misreading?

[Bob Hunter]

I thought he was headed there, Hans.



Sometimes within a marriage -- not your marriage apparently, but some marriages -- certain topics can become sensitive issues that are difficult to discuss. Or maybe one's spouse has bought into a particular perspective and can't see past that one point of view. Certain topics may trigger a predictable but less-than-helpful response.

I find that it's sometimes good to get a fresh perspective on things from someone who isn't so close to the situation within which you find yourself. Of course, if you commit yourself to a formal relationship with a single mentor, you can run into similar problems. You get only the one viewpoint. I guess if you can find someone you consider able to give wise and objective counsel in all areas, that will work. Personally, I haven't found that one source of consistently wise and unprejudiced advice.

Sometimes the best perspective I find on a topic comes from a child and I am knocked over by the simplicity and obvious nature of their innocent insight which they present with such refreshing honesty. That doesn't mean I want to go to that child for advice on every topic, but I would also be vastly poorer to pass over such serendipitous "mentoring."

Marsha

What is interesting is that I do not trust a single mentor for advice. In fact, it is rarely the advice they give that matters. It is the conversation and the process of discovery that makes the difference. If I am not having those conversations with someone I trust, then I cannot discover things about myself. I think we romanticize the idea of a "very wise mentor" who never fails us and helps us ascend to our personal greatness. Those people don't exist. The process of engaging in disciplined conversations with a few trusted individuals on a regular basis creates the occasion for God to say what he needs to say to us and for us to discover all that God has for us. At least that is how I see it.

[Gina Stevenson]

See what you're saying there, Bob. Sometimes we can even come up with our own answers ... as it is in just voicing things out loud sometimes that helps us clarify them in our own thinking, whereas those same things kept quiet, rattling around in our heads all alone, might not be clarified so much as when we hear ourselves say them ... and it helps to have someone there to hear them, rather than our talking out loud to ourselves.

[Bob Hunter]

See what you're saying there, Bob. Sometimes we can even come up with our own answers ... as it is in just voicing things out loud sometimes that helps us clarify them in our own thinking, whereas those same things kept quiet, rattling around in our heads all alone, might not be clarified so much as when we hear ourselves say them ... and it helps to have someone there to hear them, rather than our talking out loud to ourselves.

Yes, which it is vitally important a mentor ask the right questions instead of giving direct answers. Tom Nees offers the following observation, "Rather than giving advice, training for formal mentoring emphasizes the skill of active listening and asking good questions at the appropriate time."


Walter Wright, in his book on mentoring, suggests that mentors consider some of these questions.

• Who are you, and who do you intend to be?
• What is important here?
• What is at stake?
• Are there more choices?
• What do you fear?
• Where do you need to grow?
• What does failure teach?
• What does trust look like?
• Why?*
• Who cares?
• What might change?
• How deeply are you invested personally?
• Why should people trust you?
• How are you communicating?
• What are you communicating?
• Where does insecurity constrain you?
• Where do you experience conflict?
• How do you manage conflict?
• What does flexibility mean?
• To whom and how are you accountable?
• What is important to you?
• How healthy are your relationships?
• What are you teaching your children?
• What are you learning?
• What gives you energy?
• What legacy are you leaving?
• What does integrity mean?
• What would your granddaughter learn by following you around work?

*Asking too many why questions can put people on the defensive.

[Marsha Lynn]

What is interesting is that I do not trust a single mentor for advice. In fact, it is rarely the advice they give that matters. It is the conversation and the process of discovery that makes the difference. If I am not having those conversations with someone I trust, then I cannot discover things about myself. I think we romanticize the idea of a "very wise mentor" who never fails us and helps us ascend to our personal greatness. Those people don't exist. The process of engaging in disciplined conversations with a few trusted individuals on a regular basis creates the occasion for God to say what he needs to say to us and for us to discover all that God has for us. At least that is how I see it.

So then ... formal mentoring relationships with a "few trusted individuals" is not so much about the wisdom of those individuals as willingness on my part to "get real" with a few people and the ability and willingness of the trusted few to listen well.

[Bob Hunter]

So then ... formal mentoring relationships with a "few trusted individuals" is not so much about the wisdom of those individuals as willingness on my part to "get real" with a few people and the ability and willingness of the trusted few to listen well.

Well, yes which is why asking the right questions is so important. See my response to Gina.

But let me just say, I do not like the accountability partner model. Using that label invokes fear and places too much emphasis on doing. A mentoring partnership, however, is all about relationships. So relational content is high. God will give you the wisdom you need as you engage in these crucial conversations.

[Jim Franklin]

Our SS teacher is the same person who conducts our Wednesday night study. The Wesleyan quarterly is used on Sunday and a "Wisdom of the Word" booklet is used on Wednesday night. He is a very gifted discussion leader who happens to be a physical therapist at a local hospital. On Sunday night we are following the Lectionary. I feel very spiritually enriched by each of these studies and the commentary shared and the bonding of each of the groups to draw closer to our Savior and Master. I believe we are mentoring each other in each venue.

[Kyle Borger]

Reading Hans question about mentoring with his wife; I wanted to add to that conversation.

You should meet with your wife. You are a discipleship group. As you would meet with your children and disciple them as well. However you should also disciple someone else outside of your family. Instead of thinking about it in terms of needing the relationship because you are missing something with your wife, you should see it as how you are expanding the Kingdom.

The great commission is about making disciples. We make friends so that we are building up authority in the lives of others so that if they become receptive to the Holy Spirit we are ready to introduce them to a deeper relationship.

What I have discovered is that the learning process or maturing process doesn't happen so much as the disciple, but is so much greater as the discipler. The experience we have had at our church is that when the person who is being discipled begins to disciple they really begin to grow spiritually. It is for this reason that everyone should be encouraged to immediately begin watching for who Jesus would have them disciple. The Holy Spirit is the one at work and the one who provides what we need. So while we do want to learn more, it isn't necessary to take a minimum number of classes before a person is allowed to disciple someone. They simply must be in a discipleship relationship where their mentor is observing and providing guidance.

In Africa there was unprecedented growth. The leaders came from the harvest. Many pastors were only 6 months ahead of their congregations in education and experience. We don't have to wait for leaders to be trained. We simply begin harvesting and train the leaders as they show up.

Yes, there are discussions that can be had between two men that can't necessarily be had between husband and wife. Is this true of all relationships? Perhaps not, but it is usually the case in someone who is an infant in their spiritual maturity. You do grow from mentoring someone, but it isn't about you.

Mentoring or discipleship works when you are concerned about them. That is why we do it. We get so focused on fixing ourselves we forget about them. Many times what fixes us is when we allow God to use us to reach them.