Sabbath and Worship

[Mike Schutz]

We are using Naznetter Ryan Scott's new book The Sinai Experiment for our Wednesday study. It is working great as a basis for a multi-generational group of 20-25 adults.

Tonight's study considers the commandment regarding Sabbath. A discussion question Ryan offers asks the following:

Are our worship services too busy? Do we practice Sabbath in our worship? What could we do to better prepare and enable ourselves to practice Sabbath in our Sabbath worship?

What do you think?

[Marsha Lynn]

We are using Naznetter Ryan Scott's new book The Sinai Experiment for our Wednesday study. It is working great as a basis for a multi-generational group of 20-25 adults.

Tonight's study considers the commandment regarding Sabbath. A discussion question Ryan offers asks the following:

Are our worship services too busy? Do we practice Sabbath in our worship? What could we do to better prepare and enable ourselves to practice Sabbath in our Sabbath worship?

What do you think?

OK, this probably won't come as a shock to you, but here's my opinion:

I don't think our worship services are too busy. I think our Sundays are too busy.

If all I have to do on Sunday is teach the lesson I prepared during the week, play the music I practiced during the week, give the gifts I prepared during the week, and bring the heart of worship I have nurtured during the week, then worship is truly a time of Sabbath rest. One of the most restful feelings I know is that of having every task complete that needs to be complete and knowing that the world can go on without me until Monday morning while I worship, fellowship, and relax. I seldom get there completely and sometimes miss it by a mile, but it's what I aim for and I know there is Sabbath rest in it.

I would say there are two ways a worship service can be too busy.

1. If those leading it are, like Martha, distracted by the "many things" that 'need' to be done -- either because they are trying to do too much or because they are failing to budget their six other days in such a way that they can finish their preparations ahead of time.

2. If it is designed in such a way that it leaves people exhausted from the sheer pace of the activity included. If that is the case, the leaders need to watch a few episodes of "Mr. Rogers' Neighborhood"* and note the elements that can make half an hour of nonstop activity seem relaxed and unhurried.

Marsha


*Cultural note: "Mr. Roger's Neighborhood" was a long-running public television show for young children hosted by an incredibly talented former Presbyterian minister. In the trademark (and often mocked) opening of each episode, Mr. Rogers came in singing, took off his suit jacket and put on a sweater, then took off his dress shoes and put on tennis shoes as a symbol of the unhurried space he created for children.

[Susan Unger]

We are using Naznetter Ryan Scott's new book The Sinai Experiment for our Wednesday study. It is working great as a basis for a multi-generational group of 20-25 adults.

Tonight's study considers the commandment regarding Sabbath. A discussion question Ryan offers asks the following:

Are our worship services too busy? Do we practice Sabbath in our worship? What could we do to better prepare and enable ourselves to practice Sabbath in our Sabbath worship?

What do you think?

I find church exhausting. I had to take a sabbatical from it so that I could relearn how to worship. And as I have said before [and related to Marsha's #2 point], my church is really meant for extroverts. Not being one, I am exhausted by church. On the other hand, my RCC friend's worship services are very restful for me. There is no hurried pace.

For me, personally, what would help make Church more like a sabbath would be if everyone I needed to contact regarding ministry or what not would actually respond to my emails/calls/messages in inbox instead of expecting me to track them down during church. It is not so much that ministry is too much for me, but working with others in ministry is. I could never rest on Sunday cuz I had this check off list of people I needed answers from who couldn't be bothered to reply to me during the week.

[Hans Deventer]

Are our worship services too busy? Do we practice Sabbath in our worship? What could we do to better prepare and enable ourselves to practice Sabbath in our Sabbath worship?

What do you think?

I feel our services are WAY too busy. I live by the "less is more" principle when it comes to worship. But I'm a lonely voice in my church, most seem to think that the more people and topics are involved in a service, the better it is.

[Lorie Hatcliff]

I feel our services are WAY too busy. I live by the "less is more" principle when it comes to worship. But I'm a lonely voice in my church, most seem to think that the more people and topics are involved in a service, the better it is.

I would be one of those who agree that the more people (not topics) involved in a service, the better. I like to see each age group involved. However, if you are one of those people who have to organize all involved, then YES, it is way too busy. Having been on the organizational side of it, I can understand Susan's solace in the RCC service.

So, in summary, if one is an uninvolved congregational member who just comes to worship that Sunday morning, I would say they don't feel hurried, but probably restful. If, on the other hand, you are one of the behind the scenes people involved in ministry/Sunday School, whatever, then your Sabbaths are probably far from true Sabbaths.

[Lorie Hatcliff]

As to the question Mike asked, What could we do to better prepare and enable ourselves to practice Sabbath in our Sabbath worship?! , I have no idea! Looking forward to reading the responses though.

[Billie Goodson]

We are using Naznetter Ryan Scott's new book The Sinai Experiment for our Wednesday study. It is working great as a basis for a multi-generational group of 20-25 adults.

Tonight's study considers the commandment regarding Sabbath. A discussion question Ryan offers asks the following:

Are our worship services too busy? Do we practice Sabbath in our worship? What could we do to better prepare and enable ourselves to practice Sabbath in our Sabbath worship?

What do you think?

Not sure I would say too busy. I would say too unfocused. What is the reason we gather on Sunday AM (considering that the most popular "worship service" model -- if another is it, fill it in instead)? Are the things that we do focused on achieving the purpose we state? Or, are we trying to do too many things? If what we are doing is not focused on our goals, then we are doing too much. If we aren't achieving our goals, we are doing too little, or the wrong things. My thoughts, maybe we can "afford" two goals for a corporate worship time, any more and we risk watering down our results. Is our purpose fellowship? Is it instruction? Maybe we go back to the five functions of the church and think which of those we can accomplish on Sunday am.

1. Worship
2. Discipleship
3. Evangelism
4. Fellowship
5. Ministry

Then perhaps we look at our forms, and decide if those satisfy or feed a function.

What could we better do to prepare? Be intentional.

My random thoughts

[John Kennedy]

I'd almost be willing to advance the proposition, re the 5 functions (worship, discipleship, evangelism, fellowship, ministry) that if you're not accomplishing the first one, worship, you might as well forget the
rest of them. A well-planned service of worship can certainly facilitate the other functions, but, IMO, the primary reason for not sleeping in on Sunday AM is to be able to corporately come into the presence of the living God.

I think worship is a bit more difficult for those leading, and it gets racheted up a notch or two if the leader has played a role in planning. I direct music in a small church. My official assignment is that of choir director, but I feel strongly that an essential responsibility of the church musician is to help make the liturgy truly the 'work of the people'.

While I get paid to produce a credible and listenable anthem each Sunday morning, my role has sort of evolved into one of service planning. I prepare a tentative order of service and then refine it in consultation with the minister.

I try to use hymns and responses that enhance the 'God-focus' and make it less easy for the congregation to fall into the trap of becoming an 'audience'.

I remember once writing about 'God-focused' worship on NN and being informed by some that 'God-focused' was a given. Maybe I'm in a minority, but I've attended more than my share of 'worship' services where someone evidently didn't get the 'focus' memo.

The tension between planning/leading/worship was brought home to me a few Sundays ago. Every few months we have a service that combines a narration with related choral/special/congregational music - in some respects a kind of 'sermon in song'. I told the choir, as we were getting ready to start the procesional hymn, that my prayer for them was that in the midst of making sure the correct text and notes were sung, I hoped that they would be able to 'let go' and really lose themselves in the praise of God.

I sing in a community chorus under the direction of a man whose mastery of church music (director/composer/arranger) leaves me in awe. For years he directed an Advent event called the Feast of Lights. He continually hammered away at the chorus that our presentation was not that of a concert - we were leading in a service of worship.

The service was presented four times in as many days. Our last act before processing into the university chapel was to join in a prayer, "Bless, O Lord, your servants, who minister in your temple; grant that what we sing with our lips we may believe in our hearts, and that what we believe in our hearts, we may show forth in our lives. Through Christ our Lord. Amen." Then he would send us forth with these words: "Go in there and let the glory of the Lord get all over you!"

[Mike Schutz]

Discussed this in our Wednesday study and received some interesting responses.

Several said that they did not feel "busyness" or "hurried" in worship, but that the environment allows them to be "fully present" (amazing when your own words come back months and years later). One person even said that the restoration that happens both in worship, and in our "adult conversations" (what we call adult Sunday school) after worship, provide the centering needed for the rest of the week.
One person said that they wish they weren't so easily distracted, but they do notice when those in leadership are not relaxed. I need to be aware of that.

[John Kennedy]

I keep tellin' myself, "Get a grip.....and relax."

[Billie Goodson]

I'd almost be willing to advance the proposition, re the 5 functions (worship, discipleship, evangelism, fellowship, ministry) that if you're not accomplishing the first one, worship, you might as well forget the
rest of them.

John, I really appreciated your whole post. If I can only add one little caveat in regards to your statement quoted above. In my opinion, the five functions are equally important for the church. I agree with your statement that if you aren't accomplishing worship, the you can forget the rest. I also think if you forget any of the rest, then you may not really have worship. You might have a great performance and maybe even some terrific music and good speaking. But, I wonder if God was truly worshipped. That may be because it seems to me that obedience is our highest worship and if the church is not performing those functions, then it seems to be missing it's purpose.

[John Kennedy]

John, I really appreciated your whole post. If I can only add one little caveat in regards to your statement quoted above. In my opinion, the five functions are equally important for the church. I agree with your statement that if you aren't accomplishing worship, the you can forget the rest. I also think if you forget any of the rest, then you may not really have worship. You might have a great performance and maybe even some terrific music and good speaking. But, I wonder if God was truly worshipped. That may be because it seems to me that obedience is our highest worship and if the church is not performing those functions, then it seems to be missing it's purpose.

I certainly have no doubt as to the vital importance of all of them. I am, however, of the opinion that many, if not most, of these elements are implicit in worship. I kind of see worship, in this instance, as being like a wheel and these functions or components as being spokes in that wheel.
I realize that this, like just about every analogy, falls short. Take fellowship, for example. I have seen services which went to great lengths to convey a sense of fellowship. The result was a sort of superficial, feel-good horizontal thing. It was as though fellowship became the focus, the goal. But if God is the center, the focus, as worshippers move toward the center, they also move closer to each other.

I guess my point would be that if we really believe that an encounter with the living God is a thing that that produces profound change, why not concentrate on that encounter and let God do the changing.

[Lorie Hatcliff]

So to those who lead or plan worship or teach Sunday School or do a host of any other things on that morning...do you have any problems practicing Sabbath in your own personal worship?

[Marsha Lynn]

So to those who lead or plan worship or teach Sunday School or do a host of any other things on that morning...do you have any problems practicing Sabbath in your own personal worship?

Do you mean personal worship as in times apart from Sunday morning or on Sunday morning while actively involved in the mechanics of corporate worship?

I consider my times alone with God to be breath and life for each day. Corporate worship is more challenging, primarily because of the distraction of having people around me, but no more so when I'm actively involved than when I'm a pew-sitter trying to engage in worship being "conducted" by others. The difference to me is that when I'm directly involved, even when just off to the side playing the piano, it seems that my own engagement level affects that of others. That observation makes me work harder at being prepared for not just my part in the service but for being in a spirit of worship.

On the other hand, the attitude the pew-sitters bring to the service with them may be just as influential on the overall atmosphere as that of those who are more actively involved. It's just not so noticeable to me.

Marsha

[G R 'Scott' Cundiff]

A key for me and a small, but faithful, before Sunday School prayer group that meets each week. For 15 or 20 minutes we pray in a quiet manner for the services and events at the church that day. As that prayer group goes so goes the Sunday morning worship service.

I generally carry with me a sense of the quiet focus throughout the morning - which, for a pastor, is saying a lot.

That prayer time balances out all the people who "need to just talk to me for a minute" as I move toward the service.

A second key is understanding worship as not only part of Sabbath but also as Celebration. The worship service doesn't have to be low keyed and "restful" to be a proper Sabbath event. Celebrations are refreshing and lifting. Even our announcements (someone's new grand baby or some swimming medals as we had last week) have a feeling of celebration in them.

The best use of the Sabbath isn't to "lay in one spot without moving" as some thought in Jesus' day. Rather it's a time for rejuvenation and refreshment.

[Ryan Scott]

I'm not sure if I get a voice in the answer since it was my question to begin with.

I'm not so much about saying what Sabbath should be as I am, I think, very adamant that it should NOT be busy.

As I looked at what Sabbath meant in practice, it's roots and origins, and early practice, it just be came very apparent that Sabbath is the time when we step out of our everyday lives and faithfully commit, through our actions, that we believe the world will not fall apart without us.

I've seen personally how the need to "fit everything in" and meet a time schedule (usually so people can get off to other 'more important' things) can rob our worship of a sense of Sabbath. I'm not convinced worship and Sabbath have to go together, but for all practical purposes they do for 99% of the Christians I know.

[Billie Goodson]

I'm not sure if I get a voice in the answer since it was my question to begin with.

I'm not so much about saying what Sabbath should be as I am, I think, very adamant that it should NOT be busy.

As I looked at what Sabbath meant in practice, it's roots and origins, and early practice, it just be came very apparent that Sabbath is the time when we step out of our everyday lives and faithfully commit, through our actions, that we believe the world will not fall apart without us.

I've seen personally how the need to "fit everything in" and meet a time schedule (usually so people can get off to other 'more important' things) can rob our worship of a sense of Sabbath. I'm not convinced worship and Sabbath have to go together, but for all practical purposes they do for 99% of the Christians I know.

I don't think that is what the original author meant. You have to realize the context he was writing from. When he said "sabbath", he meant "rest" and since he was a recent college student (albeit graduate level) we all know that his "rest" was different than our "rest".

[Marsha Lynn]

I don't think that is what the original author meant. You have to realize the context he was writing from. When he said "sabbath", he meant "rest" and since he was a recent college student (albeit graduate level) we all know that his "rest" was different than our "rest".

All right, Ryan. Just admit it. You laughed -- maybe even out loud! You may as well push the button.

Cute post, Billie.

[Ryan Scott]

All right, Ryan. Just admit it. You laughed -- maybe even out loud! You may as well push the button.

You'd be surprised. My wife will tell you she can probably count the number of times she's heard me really laugh on one hand - and we've been married six years now. It takes a lot to really strike me as funny, which is why I appreciate good comedy so much.

[Marsha Lynn]

You'd be surprised. My wife will tell you she can probably count the number of times she's heard me really laugh on one hand - and we've been married six years now. It takes a lot to really strike me as funny, which is why I appreciate good comedy so much.

How often do you laugh on both hands? Is laughing on a hand different than having laughter on your face and in your eyes? (I guess it is when a mouse and laugh button are involved.)

I thought Billie's post was pretty good comedy. But then I'm easily amused by cleverness.

I probably laugh out loud more now than ever before in my life. I find that people appreciate having their attempts at humor appreciated so I am more intentional in moving the humorous response in my heart out to my face as a simple gift to those who provoke it.

On the other hand (left non-mousing hand), I don't laugh much (particularly at attempts at humor as lame as this one) and should probably just accept the fact that you don't with either hand. No more cheap shots about the laugh button.