don't stone me

[Sarah Smith]

but now I am officially UMC.

Still Wesleyan, just a better all around fit for our family in this particular town.

Can you be Nazodist?

[Dave McClung]

but now I am officially UMC.

Still Wesleyan, just a better all around fit for our family in this particular town.

Can you be Nazodist?

Sure, but you know what we believe, "Once a Nazarene always a Nazarene."

[Benjamin Burch]

but now I am officially UMC.

Still Wesleyan, just a better all around fit for our family in this particular town.

Can you be Nazodist?

Next Easter I will most likely be officially Episcopal. Looks like I'll have to drop my stone...

[Greg Farra]

Until the COTN has an Emmaus type renewal movement, we'll have to tolerate the Methodists! (just kidding)

Glad you found a place to call home.

[John Kennedy]

When I took my leave 35+ years ago, there was no stone throwing from either direction. I was neither thrower nor throwee. I, too, am glad you found a place to call home.

[John Kennedy]

"Can you be Nazodist?"

Sure beats being Nazidost.

[Dennis M. Scott]

When I took my leave 35+ years ago, there was no stone throwing from either direction. I was neither thrower nor throwee. I, too, am glad you found a place to call home.

We just don't quite know how to tell you how happy we are . . . for you.

[John Kennedy]

We just don't quite know how to tell you how happy we are . . . for you.

Inquiring too closely about the motivations for happiness can only lead to despair. Take the money and run.

[Susan Unger]

Now, you'll be doing Methodist Meditations instead of Nazarene Naps!

[John Kennedy]

Now, you'll be doing Methodist Meditations instead of Nazarene Naps!

Maybe someday there'll be a new ecumenical organization composed of those who do Methodist Meditations, Nazarene Naps and those who became loyal members of Bedside Baptist during their college days.

[Kami Tuenning]

Next Easter I will most likely be officially Episcopal. Looks like I'll have to drop my stone...

Congratulations! : )

[David Graham]

but now I am officially UMC.

Still Wesleyan, just a better all around fit for our family in this particular town.

Can you be Nazodist?

Sure, and I suspect that I am! In Australia the Uniting Church (which is made up of mostly former Methodists) in which I am a member & minister would be very close to the UMC in doctrine, practice & policy.

[Edith Thurmond]

Next Easter I will most likely be officially Episcopal. Looks like I'll have to drop my stone...

That's interesting, especially in light of the fact that I witnessed more Nazarenes become Episcopalians today.

-et-

[G R 'Scott' Cundiff]

Wow - it's almost as if this is "Used-to-be-Nazarenenet.com."

[Pete Vecchi]

but now I am officially UMC.

Still Wesleyan, just a better all around fit for our family in this particular town.

Can you be Nazodist?

I have often said that with my background, I'm a Catholuthermethorene.

[Benjamin Burch]

I have often said that with my background, I'm a Catholuthermethorene.

That stuff can't be good for you...

[Rich Schmidt]

Next Easter I will most likely be officially Episcopal. Looks like I'll have to drop my stone...

Reading this reminded me of this paragraph from the Wikipedia entry on the Episcopal Church (USA). I'd read it a while back, and for some reason this paragraph stuck.

A common mistake by non-Episcopalians is over the use of the words "Episcopal" and "Episcopalians". An Episcopalian is a member of the Episcopal Church but it is not the Episcopalian Church. Likewise, a member is not called an Episcopal, like a Methodist is a member of the Methodist Church. Episcopalian is a noun; Episcopal is an adjective.

You don't appear to be making the mistake they're mentioning, but I thought I'd share it anyway, in the spirit of helping all of us non-Episcopalians know what to call you.

[Benjamin Burch]

That's interesting, especially in light of the fact that I witnessed more Nazarenes become Episcopalians today.

-et-

Seems that Holy Week cemented in my heart that your prediction was correct.

[Rich Schmidt]

Until the COTN has an Emmaus type renewal movement, we'll have to tolerate the Methodists! (just kidding)

Glad you found a place to call home.

I'm going to be one of the clergy speakers at an Emmaus walk later this month. I've been told that the intention is for the Emmaus movement to include more than just Methodists, and the local Emmaus community here is starting to make an effort to include other churches.

You probably knew that already, so this is more FYI for those who aren't as familiar with it.

[Benjamin Burch]

Reading this reminded me of this paragraph from the Wikipedia entry on the Episcopal Church (USA). I'd read it a while back, and for some reason this paragraph stuck.



You don't appear to be making the mistake they're mentioning, but I thought I'd share it anyway, in the spirit of helping all of us non-Episcopalians know what to call you.

Haha, yea. I caught on after a week or two of interaction with Episcopalians. Before that, I got it wrong all the time!

[Lorie Hatcliff]

In a nutshell how do Episcopalians differ in belief than Nazarenes? Is there some big fundamental difference? I know their worship service is very liturgical, but I'm wondering about their beliefs specifically.

[Benjamin Burch]

In a nutshell how do Episcopalians differ in belief than Nazarenes? Is there some big fundamental difference? I know their worship service is very liturgical, but I'm wondering about their beliefs specifically.

The major difference is that officially, The Episcopal Church does not consider monogamous homosexual "marriage" sinful (under the same expectations of any marriage), and they ordain homosexuals. They also would not agree with Article X, or any idea of Entire Sanctification as Nazarenes do.

Other than that, they're relatively similar. The Episcopal Church is part of the Anglican Commune, of which Wesley (Church of England) was a part. The Episcopal Church is, on the whole, generally more liberal than the CotN, but there is a lot of overlap, in that both are rather large tents. Thus, a great many folks could move easily between the two. However, more liberal ECUSA folks could not fit comfortably in the CotN, and AHM Nazarenes would probably not fit at all in the ECUSA.

In practice, there is very little theological difference when it comes to major theological categories - except Sanctification. Ethics would be the largest difference between the two. I will find out more "specifics" when I go through the class, but in general it's a huge tent, in which conservative and liberal Anglicans would be accepted (though most conservatives would be very uncomfortable, evidenced by the split by ACNA).

Hope that helps.

And yes, as far as worship goes, you could say we're "very liturgical." At my cathedral here in SD, there is little difference between our mass and the Catholic Mass, aside from the obvious fact that we're following the BCP.

P.S. I feel like maybe this is hijacking? If someone wants to split this, I guess they can. I don't want to end up stealing the conversation!

@ Sarah: I am very glad you have found a Church home that works for you! Being on a similar path, I can certainly relate!

[Rich Schmidt]

The major difference is that officially, The Episcopal Church does not consider monogamous homosexual "marriage" sinful (under the same expectations of any marriage), and they ordain homosexuals. They also would not agree with Article X, or any idea of Entire Sanctification as Nazarenes do.

Other than that, they're relatively similar. The Episcopal Church is part of the Anglican Commune, of which Wesley (Church of England) was a part. ...

I think it might be helpful to point out that the Episcopal Church (USA) has seriously strained that Anglican Communion by taking the steps they have surrounding homosexuality. If the ECUSA continues its independent streak, I wouldn't be surprised to see it "disfellowshipped" (or whatever it's called) from the rest of the Anglican Communion at some point. Since you mentioned the ACNA, I went to their website, where I found the following on their About page:

Globally, regionally and locally, Anglicanism is in the process of reformation. Within the last decades, the Episcopal Church in the United States and the Anglican Church of Canada have increasingly accommodated and incorporated un-Biblical, un-Anglican practices and teaching.

In the context of this widening theological gap, the existing geography-based organizational model of the Episcopal Church and Anglican Church of Canada became problematic for orthodox Anglicans. Orthodox parishes, clergy and dioceses that upheld Biblical authority and historic Anglican practice became isolated within their existing structures.

Distressed churches and entire dioceses began to disaffiliate from the established provinces in North America and seek episcopal oversight and spiritual care from Anglican Provinces and leaders in other parts of the world, including the primates and churches of Kenya, Nigeria, Rwanda, South America and Uganda. Beginning in 2000 with the Church of Rwanda, these leaders have responded by accepting orthodox Anglican parishes and dioceses in North America into their care.

[Benjamin Burch]

I think it might be helpful to point out that the Episcopal Church (USA) has seriously strained that Anglican Communion by taking the steps they have surrounding homosexuality. If the ECUSA continues its independent streak, I wouldn't be surprised to see it "disfellowshipped" (or whatever it's called) from the rest of the Anglican Communion at some point. Since you mentioned the ACNA, I went to their website, where I found the following on their About page:

You might be right, but at the same time, the Archbishop of Canterbury is pro-homosexual, and many feel that the Anglican Church as a whole (in Australia and New Zealand, for example) are not so far behind them.

It should be very interesting.

[Paul DeBaufer]

Sarah, I too have become a member of the UMC back in March. For me it is a much better fit than the Nazarene church within driving distance for me.

[Meghan Schoonover]

I was a member of the UMC for 3 yrs. of my college days...I was their organist. I liked it quite a bit.

[Hans Deventer]

Wow - it's almost as if this is "Used-to-be-Nazarenenet.com."

Scott, if needs be, we'll keep it "NazNet" even if you and I are the last ones standing

[John Kennedy]

Scott, if needs be, we'll keep it "NazNet" even if you and I are the last ones standing

That'll be OK as long as you don't start thinking of yourselves as 'the remnant'.

[Hans Deventer]

That'll be OK as long as you don't start thinking of yourselves as 'the remnant'.

John, don't worry. It's been over 30 years that I would have thought that way.

[David Graham]

You might be right, but at the same time, the Archbishop of Canterbury is pro-homosexual, and many feel that the Anglican Church as a whole (in Australia and New Zealand, for example) are not so far behind them.

It should be very interesting.

Except for the Arch-Diocese of Sydney, which is conservative evangelical

[John Kennedy]

John, don't worry. It's been over 30 years that I would have thought that way.

If I'd been remotely worried about it, I'd never have posted it. One of the things I've appreciated about NN, and, by extension, the denomination, is that a lot of that 'circle the wagons' mentality that I encountered doesn't seem to be there anymore. Even though my choice was to go elsewhere, I'll always have a deep affection for the church that provided a place for my parents to minister.

[John Kennedy]

That stuff can't be good for you...

Only if you're baptized with your mouth open.

[Wanda VanWinkle]

Love UMC. Happy for you!

[David Pettigrew]

The major difference is that officially, The Episcopal Church does not consider monogamous homosexual "marriage" sinful (under the same expectations of any marriage), and they ordain homosexuals. They also would not agree with Article X, or any idea of Entire Sanctification as Nazarenes do.

Other than that, they're relatively similar. The Episcopal Church is part of the Anglican Commune, of which Wesley (Church of England) was a part. The Episcopal Church is, on the whole, generally more liberal than the CotN, but there is a lot of overlap, in that both are rather large tents. Thus, a great many folks could move easily between the two. However, more liberal ECUSA folks could not fit comfortably in the CotN, and AHM Nazarenes would probably not fit at all in the ECUSA.

In practice, there is very little theological difference when it comes to major theological categories - except Sanctification. Ethics would be the largest difference between the two. I will find out more "specifics" when I go through the class, but in general it's a huge tent, in which conservative and liberal Anglicans would be accepted (though most conservatives would be very uncomfortable, evidenced by the split by ACNA).

Hope that helps.

And yes, as far as worship goes, you could say we're "very liturgical." At my cathedral here in SD, there is little difference between our mass and the Catholic Mass, aside from the obvious fact that we're following the BCP.

P.S. I feel like maybe this is hijacking? If someone wants to split this, I guess they can. I don't want to end up stealing the conversation!

@ Sarah: I am very glad you have found a Church home that works for you! Being on a similar path, I can certainly relate!

Ben, I appreciate and affirm your journey. This and 1.60 will get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks, but Episcopalians, like Nazarenes, vary widely on these matters, and the "official" position is actually determined by the diocese of which you are a member. For instance, the Forth Worth bishop still refuses to ordain women, while the Dallas bishop has appointed several women as rectors. My wife's former boss couldn't attend a mission trip in the role of priest, because the rector of the sponsoring church didn't recognize female priests as legitimate.

So, you know your own reasons and must follow your heart, but if your primary reason is social, make sure you know the position of your bishop. I can't imagine a parish in this diocese that would participate in a homosexual union or accept an openly homosexual priest. Most of the rectors here are so in favor of traditional marriage, they've had at least two or three!

[Edith Thurmond]

In a nutshell how do Episcopalians differ in belief than Nazarenes? Is there some big fundamental difference? I know their worship service is very liturgical, but I'm wondering about their beliefs specifically.

Lori, one of the best guides to Anglican belief is the 39 Articles of Religion which are printed in every BCP. Other documents that affirm our theology are the Nicene Creed and the Apostles' Creed.

Even before this modern day topic of sexual ethics emerged that has caused so much division, there were major theological differences from the RCC. Our area is in the conservative arm of Anglicanism and I could never imagine some of this "newfangled theology" playing out at our church. We are still a 1928 Prayer Book parish which uses the 1940 Hymnal. And our rector and all other priests have only been married once and take it seriously!

-et-

[Valisha Trammell Hall]

That's interesting, especially in light of the fact that I witnessed more Nazarenes become Episcopalians today.

-et-

I went from Nazarene to Episcopalian and back to Nazarene. We left our particular Episcopal church, after 10 years, because the the people were not friendly and my kids hated going to church. I really miss the book of common prayer, but love that BFC has a wonderful pastor, friendly people, and that my teenagers enjoy going to church.

[Edith Thurmond]

I went from Nazarene to Episcopalian and back to Nazarene. We left our particular Episcopal church, after 10 years, because the the people were not friendly and my kids hated going to church. I really miss the book of common prayer, but love that BFC has a wonderful pastor, friendly people, and that my teenagers enjoy going to church.

I think that Sarah's thread highlights that people find a place to call "home" where they can experience God the best, enjoy fellowship in that faith community, and serve God with their abilities. What resonates with some, doesn't with others. It's wonderful that you and your family have found that place and it's especially important for teens to enjoy going to church. Continued blessings, Valisha!

[Sarah Smith]

Thanks to all for the encouragement.

There will still be times we join with the local CotN, such as VBS, concerts, and some special days.

DH is going to continue with ELCA most Sundays, joining us at times at the UMC. Third Sundays and some special times we will go with him.

Worship style was the main reason we switched. Our attention spans were just too short for the way things are done at the CotN. Also, we are more liturgical/sacramental and so UMC fits better. We get pretty lively at the UMC during the singing, but within a more liturgical setting.

But the CotN pastor is very good. We also get some good Wesleyan preaching from the ECUSA minister (ret) who is serving as intermim at the ELCA church. The lady who pastors the UMC church is also an excellent Wesleyan preacher.

This isn't one of those "I got ticked off at so and so or thus and such so I left" deals. It has been a long time coming with a deep hunger for a worship more centered in Christ and redemption than in humans and their struggles. More looking up instead of looking inward.

Again, thanks.

[Paul DeBaufer]

I use the Book of Common Prayer from the Protestant Espiscopal Church in the USA. I find it very helpful for my prayer life. I also use oremus.org which is Anglican in nature.

[Benjamin Burch]

Ben, I appreciate and affirm your journey. This and 1.60 will get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks, but Episcopalians, like Nazarenes, vary widely on these matters, and the "official" position is actually determined by the diocese of which you are a member. For instance, the Forth Worth bishop still refuses to ordain women, while the Dallas bishop has appointed several women as rectors. My wife's former boss couldn't attend a mission trip in the role of priest, because the rector of the sponsoring church didn't recognize female priests as legitimate.

So, you know your own reasons and must follow your heart, but if your primary reason is social, make sure you know the position of your bishop. I can't imagine a parish in this diocese that would participate in a homosexual union or accept an openly homosexual priest. Most of the rectors here are so in favor of traditional marriage, they've had at least two or three!

David,

Thanks, you are correct in all of this. I was simply trying to paint with as broad a brush as possible so as to give the "nutshell" which was asked for.

I also meant to put "officially" in quotations, to show that it's not concrete, but apparently failed to do so. Thank you for being more careful than myself.

Also, social reasons have nothing to do with my journey. I will be perfectly comfortable in any diocese on that particular issue.