I am asking for your help

[Dave McClung]

The purpose of this post is simply to ask for your help.

In the early days, NazNet was very much a "fellowship" board. Many friendships and at least one marriage have resulted from that fellowship. Facebook, Twitter and other social media have become competitors for the fellowship aspects, but I believe there is still a legitimate role for NazNet. It is still the best forum available for discussion of issues that are common to Nazarenes and friends.

My concern is that the conflicts that have become so common in U.S. society have invaded NazNet as well. It shouldn't be that way. My vision is that when outsiders look at NazNet, they will say "Behold, how they love one another."

I am not sure exactly how to do it, but I want to shift the tone of NazNet back to a friendlier, kinder forum. If that means that I have to exercise my authority as owner from time to time, I am prepared to do that. If I have to ban someone, I will do my best to be kind as I do it.

One of my all-time favorite books is "Getting to Yes" by Roger Fisher and William Ury. One chapter is on "Separate the People from the Problem." The idea is that we can differ strongly on issues, but still be soft toward one another. That is what I want for NazNet. It is fine to differ on issues, but let's be kind to one another.

Shifting the tone on NazNet back to a kinder and gentler tone isn't something I can do by myself. I pledge to do my part. I am asking that you help me in this effort. What can you do?

1. Guard your own attitudes -- "a soft answer turneth away wrath..."
2. Give others the benefit of the doubt, but if someone consistently contributes to a harsh tone, point it out to me.
3. If I need correction, please be gentle and private, but correct me.

[Peggy Gray]

Thank you, thank you, thank you

[Gene Tatsch]

....My vision is that when outsiders look at NazNet, they will say "Behold, how they love one another."...

The mark of followers of Jesus ... thanks much/gene --

[Dave McClung]

I do want to share a conversation with you. I have a friend who owns a forum that uses the same software that NazNet uses. He is a Christian who belongs to another denomination. I invited him to join NazNet. He did for a few months.

He was highly complimentary of how civil most of the people on NazNet are. He said that for the most part, NazNet is a good, Christian witness. Thanks.

[David Graham]

I'm fully supportive of what you are trying to do Dave. Thanks!

[Glenda Harvey]

I've been sticking to the Good Clean Fun threads and staying out of the rest this year. I enjoy a respectful debate but unfortunately it doesn't always stay respectful.

[Rich Schmidt]

Thanks for the reminder and the challenge, Dave!

[Greg Farra]

I'd say for the most part we are, civil but then again I was on Beliefnet for quite a while, as was Glenda. This place is a Sunday school picnic compared to that place. But then again, I don't debate much here, either.

[Hal Kreps]

Almost quit following NazNet because of......well, just because. Thank you Dave for you insight and comments.

[Marsha Gupton]

Thank you Dave. I have thoroughly enjoyed my years on naznet and have met many dear friends through this forum.

[Todd Erickson]

I've pretty much stopped posting or following on Naznet because the stuff that I tend to be interested in becomes so contentious that it's not worth following. I can go elsewhere and get accused of things or ignored. :P

[Gary Creely]

I'd say for the most part we are, civil but then again I was on Beliefnet for quite a while, as was Glenda. This place is a Sunday school picnic compared to that place. But then again, I don't debate much here, either.

From the time Naznet started to now the role of the forum has indeed shifted, and as Dave mentioned social media takes care of much of the fellowship role. Forums have become, well forums more than message boards. I contribute to a few different forums, and lurk on several others, and Naznet is by far the kindest and gentlest. I think starting from the presidential election onward the atmosphere has been tense. I can't help but thinking the post election "crash" was just a way of getting rid of some turbulent forum archive, which was probably not a bad idea (if intentional or providential).

I know I can be one of the more aggressive Nazneters, and I am intentional to try not to be personally offensive and generally "play nice" (not that I always achieve that intention). I think it is right to treat folks the way we would like to be treated, in fact it seems I have read that somewhere. A reminder of this should always be a welcomed thing.

[Susan Unger]

I think starting from the presidential election onward the atmosphere has been tense.

Agreed. Even though I didn't participate much in that discussion it affected me. I noticed this especially when a few months ago my mother reminded me that the elections were coming up soon. Without thinking I yelled out "NOOOO! I haven't recovered from the last one!!"

[Cam Pence]

The purpose of this post is simply to ask for your help.

In the early days, NazNet was very much a "fellowship" board. Many friendships and at least one marriage have resulted from that fellowship. Facebook, Twitter and other social media have become competitors for the fellowship aspects, but I believe there is still a legitimate role for NazNet. It is still the best forum available for discussion of issues that are common to Nazarenes and friends.

My concern is that the conflicts that have become so common in U.S. society have invaded NazNet as well. It shouldn't be that way. My vision is that when outsiders look at NazNet, they will say "Behold, how they love one another."

I am not sure exactly how to do it, but I want to shift the tone of NazNet back to a friendlier, kinder forum. If that means that I have to exercise my authority as owner from time to time, I am prepared to do that. If I have to ban someone, I will do my best to be kind as I do it.

One of my all-time favorite books is "Getting to Yes" by Roger Fisher and William Ury. One chapter is on "Separate the People from the Problem." The idea is that we can differ strongly on issues, but still be soft toward one another. That is what I want for NazNet. It is fine to differ on issues, but let's be kind to one another.

Shifting the tone on NazNet back to a kinder and gentler tone isn't something I can do by myself. I pledge to do my part. I am asking that you help me in this effort. What can you do?

1. Guard your own attitudes -- "a soft answer turneth away wrath..."
2. Give others the benefit of the doubt, but if someone consistently contributes to a harsh tone, point it out to me.
3. If I need correction, please be gentle and private, but correct me.

Thanks for this reminder Dave. I have been disheartened by much of what you speak about and ask for forgiveness for times when I, myself, contributed to it. I think Wesley hit the nail on this one:

Though we cannot think alike, may we not love alike? May we not be of one heart, though we are not of one opinion? Without all doubt, we may. Herein all the children of God may unite, notwithstanding these smaller differences.”

[Billy Cox]

The purpose of this post is simply to ask for your help.

In the early days, NazNet was very much a "fellowship" board. Many friendships and at least one marriage have resulted from that fellowship. Facebook, Twitter and other social media have become competitors for the fellowship aspects, but I believe there is still a legitimate role for NazNet. It is still the best forum available for discussion of issues that are common to Nazarenes and friends.

My concern is that the conflicts that have become so common in U.S. society have invaded NazNet as well. It shouldn't be that way. My vision is that when outsiders look at NazNet, they will say "Behold, how they love one another."

I am not sure exactly how to do it, but I want to shift the tone of NazNet back to a friendlier, kinder forum. If that means that I have to exercise my authority as owner from time to time, I am prepared to do that. If I have to ban someone, I will do my best to be kind as I do it.

One of my all-time favorite books is "Getting to Yes" by Roger Fisher and William Ury. One chapter is on "Separate the People from the Problem." The idea is that we can differ strongly on issues, but still be soft toward one another. That is what I want for NazNet. It is fine to differ on issues, but let's be kind to one another.

Shifting the tone on NazNet back to a kinder and gentler tone isn't something I can do by myself. I pledge to do my part. I am asking that you help me in this effort. What can you do?

1. Guard your own attitudes -- "a soft answer turneth away wrath..."
2. Give others the benefit of the doubt, but if someone consistently contributes to a harsh tone, point it out to me.
3. If I need correction, please be gentle and private, but correct me.

As one who rides the edge of 'Nazarene friendly' and occasionally has a post deleted, I offer a simple observation.

If NazNet is reminiscent of the Wild West, then it reflects ineffective moderation. Case in point... I am a high volume poster and if a moderator deletes one of my posts I will be none the wiser unless the moderator alerts me. Moderators should be correcting transgressors, not just cleaning up after them...or do we care about correction?

As one who has been involved with NazNet since the beginning, I think it's also a bit of an overstatement to suggest that the NazNet forums have ever been purely about fellowship. Even as early as I can recall, I clearly remember heated discussions on theology (especially inerrancy, predestination, abortion, homosexuality, etc.) that resulted in people being banned, entire discussion threads being shut down, and thinner skinned people leaving in disgust. I also remember the entire Current Events forum being shut down for at least a month or more.

I also recall in the early days, the dismay expressed by some newcomers that we didn't simply chit-chat about our favorite Bible verse, prayer requests, praises, our fudge recipes, and other non-controversial topics.

[Billy Cox]

As one who rides the edge of 'Nazarene friendly' and occasionally has a post deleted, I offer a simple observation.

If NazNet is reminiscent of the Wild West, then it reflects ineffective moderation. Case in point... I am a high volume poster and if a moderator deletes one of my posts I will be none the wiser unless the moderator alerts me. Moderators should be correcting transgressors, not just cleaning up after them...or do we care about correction?

As one who has been involved with NazNet since the beginning, I think it's also a bit of an overstatement to suggest that the NazNet forums have ever been purely about fellowship. Even as early as I can recall, I clearly remember heated discussions on theology (especially inerrancy, predestination, abortion, homosexuality, etc.) that resulted in people being banned, entire discussion threads being shut down, and thinner skinned people leaving in disgust. I also remember the entire Current Events forum being shut down for at least a month or more.

I also recall in the early days, the dismay expressed by some newcomers that we didn't simply chit-chat about our favorite Bible verse, prayer requests, praises, our fudge recipes, and other non-controversial topics.

Realizing my post sounds pretty non-repentant, I want to personally thank Scott who has modeled a way of talking across differences in a collegial way. Not that either of us always stay on that target, but I have in recent months made efforts to soft-pedal my anti-institutional malaise and find other things to talk about.

[G R 'Scott' Cundiff]

Realizing my post sounds pretty non-repentant, I want to personally thank Scott who has modeled a way of talking across differences in a collegial way. Not that either of us always stay on that target, but I have in recent months made efforts to soft-pedal my anti-institutional malaise and find other things to talk about.

So, how much money are you wanting to borrow from me?

[John Reilly]

Hi Dave, You have my help. I love NAZNET. My brother in law Doug Kitchen introduced it to me. I have really enjoyed it. A highlight for me was the NAZNET retreat at Windsor Hills Camp, NH. I met many new friends there like Hans. I was so impressed Hans, Edwin and another friend traveled from Holland to NH. Dr. Henry Knight, a good Methodist scholar of Wesley, wrote a book, "The Conversation Matters" about the lost art of Christian Conferencing. NAZNET is a modern form of Christian Conferencing. Christian Conferencing has rules similar to the "Code of Kindness" affirmed by the Generals in the Holiness Today Issues back in Nov.Dec. 2010 I think. Wesley affirmed rules as a means of grace. It is appropriate for NAZNET to employ rules, a "Code of Kindness" to insure civility in our Christian Conferencing. Wesley would be proud. Met vriendelijke groet.

[Greg Gates]

I'm downloading the book now. What other titles would you recommend that could help me become a better pastor?

[John Kennedy]

So, how much money are you wanting to borrow from me?

I don't think he wants to borrow money. He probably has some potential (if it ever dries up) 'waterfront' property he'd make you a good deal on.

[Marsha Lynn]

As one who has been involved with NazNet since the beginning, I think it's also a bit of an overstatement to suggest that the NazNet forums have ever been purely about fellowship. Even as early as I can recall, I clearly remember heated discussions on theology (especially inerrancy, predestination, abortion, homosexuality, etc.) that resulted in people being banned, entire discussion threads being shut down, and thinner skinned people leaving in disgust. I also remember the entire Current Events forum being shut down for at least a month or more.

I also recall in the early days, the dismay expressed by some newcomers that we didn't simply chit-chat about our favorite Bible verse, prayer requests, praises, our fudge recipes, and other non-controversial topics.

Thanks, Billy. I've noted before that it probably wasn't more than a year or two into our time together that the first post was made about how NazNet used to be so much better (friendlier, less controversial, more intimate, etc.) in the good old days. Such posts have been regular entries into the conversation for almost the entire history. And a bunch of people nod and wax nostalgic about the kinder, gentler NazNet of the past in response to them.

I'm consistently amazed not only by this selective memory of days gone by but also by how many regular contributors who campaign for peace continue to take the bait offered them by people who stir up controversy. It does indeed take two to tango. I can understand it from newbies who are still learning the ropes, but I just don't get it when those who should know better walk into the same old traps over and over again. Just think of all the storage space we could save by saying nothing when we have nothing positive to say!

Still, I love it here and am only mildly irritated by having to search through the throw-away conflicts (where nothing new is said and nobody convinces anyone of how wrong they are) and the reminders about how much better NazNet was in the old days to find the good stuff.

Marsha

[Gina Stevenson]

Yes, while selectively reading now (more content, etc), still would miss this friendly interaction.

[Billy Cox]

So, how much money are you wanting to borrow from me?

A gentle word may turn away wrath, but apparently it also draws mockery.

[G R 'Scott' Cundiff]

A gentle word may turn away wrath, but apparently it also draws mockery.

It was said in good humor rather than mockery.

[Walter Thompson]

Hello my friend(s), Dave,
I haven't been on NazNet for a long time. Perhaps as long as three years or more. I hope there comes a day when the conversations are gentler and friendlier. I have a lot of life long friends on this board. I started on NazNet when I moved to Andrews, TX which was in 1995, I joined NazNet some time after that. Thanks Dave, would like to talk with you sometime about some other stuff.

[Gordon Runyon Jr]

I'm new to NazNet but I support you 100%, blessings my friend.

[Dana Grant]

Welcome, Gordon!

[Bill Morrison]

I also recall in the early days, the dismay expressed by some newcomers that we didn't simply chit-chat about our favorite Bible verse, prayer requests, praises, our fudge recipes, and other non-controversial topics.

I want to go on record that I am all for Naznetters sharing their fudge recipes (and even mailing out samples at Christmas or other times).
Non-controversial topics in general however would tend to make Naznet rather boring.

BILL

[Gina Stevenson]

I want to go on record that I am all for Naznetters sharing their fudge recipes (and even mailing out samples at Christmas or other times).
Non-controversial topics in general however would tend to make Naznet rather boring.

BILL

Bill, there have been those times when things have transpired via mail, and not just online. Sooo, maybe your hopes for some fudge won't be dashed, eh?

[Alisa Stoll]

As I was mowing yesterday, a point God made to me about Romans/the weaker brother came to mind. When I was studying this in BSF, the leader pointed out that today there are many things Christians disagree on - home school vs private vs public, etc. Mowing was my example that no one could take a negative position on. Everyone would agree that it is my right to mow my lawn at 9:00 am. However, if I have a neighbor who works third shift - as a Christian I should show love and compassion and mow in the evening - not because I am wrong but because it would hurt my neighbor's sleep and my testimony to that neighbor. The same goes for discussions here - if a weaker brother or a non-christian who is lurking is hurt - it reflects poorly on me.

Alisa

[Jon Privett]

David,

That is nice to hear.....and as a pastor who is looking for some meaningful conversation with other Nazarene folk with different experiences and opinions I hope to be forged and formed by conversation, dialogue that helps, not hurts my brain.

I feel today is sort of like an old church service I went to in the 1980's where someone decided EVERYONE in the choir needed a microphone. It was not music to my ears. Not everyone knows how to sing in the body of Christ. So I sense that everyone in our culture with a computer has a microphone but not everyone is able to make music (theologically) or sing in harmony (commumity) or follow the conductor (Spirit led).

So, for all I am worth, I will do my very best to participate in this forum in a way that will honor Christ....since I am sure those who hate my guts will read it!

Well said!

Jon

[Greg Crofford]

I've been on NazNet for only about 4 months, but have enjoyed the give-and-take. Particularly, I like the intergenerational aspect. I hope that continues.

Godspeed!

[Marsha Lynn]

I've been on NazNet for only about 4 months, but have enjoyed the give-and-take. Particularly, I like the intergenerational aspect. I hope that continues.

Godspeed!

It's good to have you here, Greg. I appreciate your contribution to the community.

By the way, although I'm not sure she met you personally, my daughter Sondra was one of the twenty-somethings in your field back in 2009 with Youth In Mission. She and her team stayed with Matt Price and family while in Benin.

Marsha

[Greg Crofford]

It's good to have you here, Greg. I appreciate your contribution to the community.

By the way, although I'm not sure she met you personally, my daughter Sondra was one of the twenty-somethings in your field back in 2009 with Youth In Mission. She and her team stayed with Matt Price and family while in Benin.

Marsha

I'm sorry Amy and I didn't get to meet Sondra. We had a few years back in the States (between missionary assignments). Hope her time in Benin was rewarding!

[Dave Earp]

Wel I am new here but thought I would share a link with guidelines for discussions where people have different beliefs. (Note: I typically converse online with folks who .. while Christian .. have very diverse views) Here is the link .. http://globalethic.org/Center/decalog.htm

Hope this is helpful and relevant to the topic.

God bless,

Dave

[Dennis M. Scott]

Welcome, Dave.

[John Kennedy]

Thanks, Billy. I've noted before that it probably wasn't more than a year or two into our time together that the first post was made about how NazNet used to be so much better (friendlier, less controversial, more intimate, etc.) in the good old days. Such posts have been regular entries into the conversation for almost the entire history. And a bunch of people nod and wax nostalgic about the kinder, gentler NazNet of the past in response to them.

I'm consistently amazed not only by this selective memory of days gone by but also by how many regular contributors who campaign for peace continue to take the bait offered them by people who stir up controversy. It does indeed take two to tango. I can understand it from newbies who are still learning the ropes, but I just don't get it when those who should know better walk into the same old traps over and over again. Just think of all the storage space we could save by saying nothing when we have nothing positive to say!

Still, I love it here and am only mildly irritated by having to search through the throw-away conflicts (where nothing new is said and nobody convinces anyone of how wrong they are) and the reminders about how much better NazNet was in the old days to find the good stuff.

Marsha

Nothing's like it used to be --- never was!

[Beverly Burrows]

glad I checked into this thread. Getting to Yes...another must have book. I'll order. I'm going to be teaching on Titus and loving one another and I bought Getting Love right, Mere Christianity and unselfishness and now want this one too. I'm glad I only teach once a month. :-)

[Wil Wrenn]

I'm new here. I'm looking forward to getting to know all of you. I hope we can get along.

[Hans Deventer]

I'm new here. I'm looking forward to getting to know all of you. I hope we can get along.

We might, but reading Dave's first post in this thread and Dennis' guidelines for dialogue would certainly help. So far, the start isn't promising.