Business Question

[Ryan Scott]

For those of you who know retail and business better than I - let me relate an adventure from earlier today and get your thoughts.


We were given a travel system (carseat and stroller combo) as a baby shower gift. We never opened it, knowing we were going to take it back. However, the person who gave us the gift lost the receipt.

We took the unopened box to Target, hoping to at least get store credit. They acknowledged it was their product. We were given two options - we could exchange it for another of the same product, or we could exchange it for an equal value of product - but all the product must come from the baby department and no other.

We have a list of target products we need for the baby, but some are outside the baby department and others are only available online. We requested a gift card to target for the amount so we could purchase what we needed.

They refused. Even the store manager said he had no authority to change or alter policy - a call to customer service resulted in the same response.

At this point I have no plans to ever shop at Target ever again - it seems like a really terrible example of customer service, but then again I may be missing something.

[Peggy Gray]

Try a different Target store

[David Parker]

Every store sets their own return policy. You are pretty much at the mercy of their policy unless you can get a management/supervision person to overrule it. I find it very hard to believe that a store manager can not overrule this in order to at least get you a general use credit through-out the store. Would be interesting to see if you get a different response in another Target location.

Depending on your relationship with the gift-giver, Target may be able to locate the purchase in their system with more information from them. (date of purchase, method of payment, etc.)

These policies are really irritating, but bear in mind that theft, return scams, and such are a huge loss item to retailers in general. They all try to control these losses in some fashion and invariably they end up impacting good honest people too. It is a tricky balance to control losses without hurting customer relations.

[Craig Laughlin]

Given that both the manager and customer service said the same thing it is indeed the company policy. It is almost assuredly a loss prevention policy to keep people from steeling some high value items that are small in one department then turning them back in and getting credit to purchase what they really want in another department that may be to large to steel. (I know car seats are to large to steel but it is a policy) I am surprised that the store manager did not take action. Usually they have the authority to override these kinds of policies. (Online customer service has to act as if there are no exceptions lest they be used to pressure local store managers)

Store policy or not, Peggy is right. Another Manager may be willing to override and let you do it, but it will definitely take a manager. Another recourse is an e-mail to Target Inc. Explain the situation nicely and ask for some relief. You might check with Walmart and see what their policy is. If they would have allowed you to exchange for anything of equal value in the store I would be tempted to politely point that out and let them know that if this is not resolved you will be shopping at Walmart in the future, sharing your story and encouraging everyone you know to do the same. (Stores are always sensitive too you going to the competition and sharing a negative story.)

Edit - Saw David's response after I posted mine.

[Marsha Lynn]

Either things are different in different areas or this is a huge change of policy at Target. Around here they used to be known as a store that would take anything back -- and they regularly got bit by that policy. Stories floated around of, for example, college students who would buy an air conditioner at the beginning of the summer and return it as defective at the end.

I haven't returned anything to Target in ages with or without a receipt so don't know their current policy other than that the receipts allow a 90-day limit for returns.

While it seems reasonable from a business standpoint to require a receipt for returns, many large chains do make exceptions.

[Peggy Gray]

I know someone who worked at a Target store a few months ago, and she said that her store's policy was esssentially, "the guest is always right". She had to grit her teeth and accept returns that she knew were bogus. Not often, but it happened.

[Jim Franklin]

Seems they have taken on the initial spirit of Spirit Airlines. Sometimes a letter to their headquarters will change someone's mind. Loss of customers as young as you means many years of loss and of course you have many friends who might join you in a boycott.

[Dave McClung]

For those of you who know retail and business better than I - let me relate an adventure from earlier today and get your thoughts.


We were given a travel system (carseat and stroller combo) as a baby shower gift. We never opened it, knowing we were going to take it back. However, the person who gave us the gift lost the receipt.

We took the unopened box to Target, hoping to at least get store credit. They acknowledged it was their product. We were given two options - we could exchange it for another of the same product, or we could exchange it for an equal value of product - but all the product must come from the baby department and no other.

We have a list of target products we need for the baby, but some are outside the baby department and others are only available online. We requested a gift card to target for the amount so we could purchase what we needed.

They refused. Even the store manager said he had no authority to change or alter policy - a call to customer service resulted in the same response.

At this point I have no plans to ever shop at Target ever again - it seems like a really terrible example of customer service, but then again I may be missing something.

Ryan

Ask the person who gave you the gift to return it. Target has a computer system that tracks purchases by credit card number. They have a very liberal policy for the original purchaser.

[John Kennedy]

Years ago I attempted to return an item to a so Cal chain that is now defunct. There may be a causal relationship between the way they handled the matter and their demise.

At the outset I told the manager that, since I no longer had receipt I would understand if he declined. He initially agreed and then, for God only knows what reason (or lack thereof) made some comment about not really knowing whether I had bought the item there. At that point I took the merchandise and walked out.

When I got home I decided to call their corporate office to complain, not about their not giving me a refund, but about the comments the idiot manager made. I called collect. Somehow or other, the HQ phone operator thought I was calling John Kennedy and I sat there laughing while they paged John Kennedy and ran up their phone bill - they had accepted the collect call.

Eventually, I reminded them that I was John Kennedy and wished to speak to their customer relations guy. I wound up with a vp of something or other who very nicely agreed to send me a replacement, plus some related merchandise.

The original price had been about $20 (and their cost was about 1/2 that and they would have probably gotten a manufacturer's credit) and by the time they got through pacifying me they probably, counting merchandise cost, phone bill, and the cost of a vp writing a letter, spent about $60-$70 that wouldn't have been spent if they had bothered to hire a manager who wasn't brain dead.

I will leave it to the judgement of the reader as to whether there was a causal relationship between my experience and the demise of the chain.

[John Kennedy]

I've had occasion to to return items to Target and used the credit card method that Dave mentioned - never had a problem. Sounds like a manager that didn't get the memo.

[Heidi Anderson]

I agree with Dave. I've never had an issue when I've personally returned something with or without a receipt as it's tied to my debit or credit card - whichever one I used. They also have gift receipts that can prove invaluable. I'm not sure what I would do if someone didn't have a receipt at all...I'm sure they've heard it all.

[Diane Likens]

My entire family stopped shopping at Target years ago for several different reasons, their harsh return policy being just one of them.

[Michael Flowers]

My fiance just got three coffee makers at her bridal shower. If they came from Target (where we are registered) I sure hope they let her return them, praying that Indiana Target stores are decent to their customers. Truthfully I really hope they came from Walmart though.

[Ryan Scott]

Ryan

Ask the person who gave you the gift to return it. Target has a computer system that tracks purchases by credit card number. They have a very liberal policy for the original purchaser.

It was purchased with cash - which is why we're in this predicament. They did tell us if the person used a credit card, they could look it up and return it.

I think what really bugs me, in this day and age, is the lack of integration between online purchases and the store. I tweeted my problem to @target and got a pretty swift response with a phone number. It turns out the phone number was for target.com customer service, but they told me if the item had been purchased online they would accept a return for a full refund, but in-store policies were different.

Right now we've got the thing listed on craig's list, but the prospects for selling it there are pretty slim.

I've contemplated going back to the target (really the only location reasonably close to us) and sitting in front of the door offering to sell it to everyone who walked in. I hate to do it, but usually if you make yourself enough of a nuisance, they'll make some exceptions.

[Marsha Lynn]

It was purchased with cash - which is why we're in this predicament. They did tell us if the person used a credit card, they could look it up and return it.

Just curious. Are you as annoyed by the person who paid cash for such a gift and then didn't hang onto the only proof of purchase in existence as you are by the store that won't accept the 'return' of an item for which there is absolutely no record of when and where or by whom it was purchased?

I'd like to join you in your ire, but really ... if you have no proof of purchase, it's only our consumer-driven society that gives you a prayer at getting anywhere with this. For all the store knows, you found it unguarded somewhere and are hoping to turn it into cash or store credit. You don't have a bit of proof that it came to you legitimately.

[Dan Henderson]

Now I don't like Target at all. Never shop there. having said that, there is a well established kiting scheme that involves frauduently returning merchandise. Many return policies are strict for that reason. I know that you porbably don't like being treated that way (I know I don't). I only post to ask you to understand that a manager might not understand why corporate policies exist. That corporate policy exists to minimize illigetimate company losses.

I think you got caught in the cross-fire of a policy that was not targeted at you. Note: I am not endorsing Target. They are not on my list of stores to buy from, I just want you to understand, its not you, its not the store, its the crooks that's messing everthing up for the rest of us.

[Ryan Scott]

Just curious. Are you as annoyed by the person who paid cash for such a gift and then didn't hang onto the only proof of purchase in existence as you are by the store that won't accept the 'return' of an item for which there is absolutely no record of when and where or by whom it was purchased?

I'd like to join you in your ire, but really ... if you have no proof of purchase, it's only our consumer-driven society that gives you a prayer at getting anywhere with this. For all the store knows, you found it unguarded somewhere and are hoping to turn it into cash or store credit. You don't have a bit of proof that it came to you legitimately.

Really frustrated with the person. Definitely. There's just really no avenue to pursue in that direction - and it's likely to create lots of relational problems if there's too much talk about it. The gift was from some of Katelynn's co-workers who went in together (hence the cash), but the person buying the gift waited too long so the store where we had our stroller/car seat picked out was closed - she resorted to getting a pretty terrible one at Target and here we are.

Again, it's frustrating, but if we make too big of a deal it just hurts her and frustrates a whole bunch of other people whose money was essentially wasted.

[Billy Cox]

For those of you who know retail and business better than I - let me relate an adventure from earlier today and get your thoughts.


We were given a travel system (carseat and stroller combo) as a baby shower gift. We never opened it, knowing we were going to take it back. However, the person who gave us the gift lost the receipt.

We took the unopened box to Target, hoping to at least get store credit. They acknowledged it was their product. We were given two options - we could exchange it for another of the same product, or we could exchange it for an equal value of product - but all the product must come from the baby department and no other.

We have a list of target products we need for the baby, but some are outside the baby department and others are only available online. We requested a gift card to target for the amount so we could purchase what we needed.

They refused. Even the store manager said he had no authority to change or alter policy - a call to customer service resulted in the same response.

At this point I have no plans to ever shop at Target ever again - it seems like a really terrible example of customer service, but then again I may be missing something.

Why not exchange the travel system for diapers in the 6-9 month range? If either of you are OCD or poopaphobic, you will go through disposable wipes like crazy too.

And if you think you ever have more diapers than you will ever use, then you are mistaken. The only possible exception is newborn diapers, because some babies outgrow newborn diapers before they are even born.

[David Parker]

Okay, as a past retail store manager, I would expect the manager to accommodate you, but if he won't/can't, then here is a work-around.

Take the store credit in the baby dept. Spend it all in the baby dept. Take back what you don't want with your purchase receipt and get your refund/store credit. It is possible that their system is sophisticated enough to forbid the return of items purchased with dedicated store credit, but I would at least try it.

[Jim Chabot]

Just curious. Are you as annoyed by the person who paid cash for such a gift and then didn't hang onto the only proof of purchase in existence as you are by the store that won't accept the 'return' of an item for which there is absolutely no record of when and where or by whom it was purchased?

I'd like to join you in your ire, but really ... if you have no proof of purchase, it's only our consumer-driven society that gives you a prayer at getting anywhere with this. For all the store knows, you found it unguarded somewhere and are hoping to turn it into cash or store credit. You don't have a bit of proof that it came to you legitimately.

A few years back, the home depot stores in our area were hit pretty hard by thieves who would actually load up items stored outside and bring them into the store to return them. You can make a good weeks pay stealing items from outside the store and returning them to the service desk. I don't know if their return policy protects them against this now since everything I buy there is with a credit card or HD commercial account.

[Ryan Scott]

Okay, as a past retail store manager, I would expect the manager to accommodate you, but if he won't/can't, then here is a work-around.

Take the store credit in the baby dept. Spend it all in the baby dept. Take back what you don't want with your purchase receipt and get your refund/store credit. It is possible that their system is sophisticated enough to forbid the return of items purchased with dedicated store credit, but I would at least try it.

Now that's an idea! Thank you, David.

We'll get to work on that. I may try one more time to speak with the store manager - but that's a pretty good option if we run out of ideas.

[Jim Chabot]

Okay, as a past retail store manager, I would expect the manager to accommodate you, but if he won't/can't, then here is a work-around.

Take the store credit in the baby dept. Spend it all in the baby dept. Take back what you don't want with your purchase receipt and get your refund/store credit. It is possible that their system is sophisticated enough to forbid the return of items purchased with dedicated store credit, but I would at least try it.

I would be really surprised if they are sophisticated enough to catch this trick! Your a smart fellow Dave!

I think that I would shop and return at two different stores though, just in case.

[Marsha Lynn]

Really frustrated with the person. Definitely. There's just really no avenue to pursue in that direction - and it's likely to create lots of relational problems if there's too much talk about it. The gift was from some of Katelynn's co-workers who went in together (hence the cash), but the person buying the gift waited too long so the store where we had our stroller/car seat picked out was closed - she resorted to getting a pretty terrible one at Target and here we are.

Again, it's frustrating, but if we make too big of a deal it just hurts her and frustrates a whole bunch of other people whose money was essentially wasted.

So Target isn't really the problem here. You have a box that originated in their store with no evidence that you came by it legitimately. This is the purpose of receipts! Yet you are hosting a thread tearing the chain down and entertaining thoughts of revenge against them in a more visible manner in your local community? I'm hesitant to pull the WWJD card, but I'll admit to seeing a sense of "standing up for my rights" here that makes me uncomfortable.

OK, 'nuff said. But I couldn't let every comment in the thread fall into the pattern of "rah-rah" for the poor receiptless consumer and "boo" for the evil box store with its heartless policies.

-------------

Disclaimer: If my thinking seems messed up, blame in on the "Daily Office," which has me in the Sermon on the Mount. Matthew 5-7 always screws up my thinking until I can get some distance from it and step back into the realities of life in the 21st century.

[Craig Laughlin]

Okay, as a past retail store manager, I would expect the manager to accommodate you, but if he won't/can't, then here is a work-around.

Take the store credit in the baby dept. Spend it all in the baby dept. Take back what you don't want with your purchase receipt and get your refund/store credit. It is possible that their system is sophisticated enough to forbid the return of items purchased with dedicated store credit, but I would at least try it.

This is a great idea.

- One caution, and there no way to know this until you try, but in the 80's I was working on these very issues with IBM via the company I worked for. Even back then they had the capacity to do this and all items were coded to department. If they are using coded receipts for credit it is technologically easy to enforce the credit to department restriction. - That being said I too would be surprised if they actually did this although the sophistication of thieves these days has caused Loss Prevention folks to get more involved in these issues.

[Ryan Scott]

I'm not sure I agree, Marsha. The store has never once questioned whether the product came from their store by legitimate means.

It's also a fifty pound box that's 18" x 24" x 48" - it's not small.

I'm not really even questioning their right to refuse the return - I'm more interested in figuring out how it's good business practice to do so.

It would make sense to refuse the return if there was some doubt to its origins - but that isn't the case and the Target manager stated as much.

Likely its a chain of events - most likely they have the $70 limit because they also have a policy of not re-selling items that are returned (even if they're unopened) and $70 was a reasonable limit to set. My next question would be why they won't re-sell non-perishable, unopened items? Likely fear that a sinister customer, like myself, would do something to the product (I'm not sure what - inject anthrax into the box, perhaps) that would harm a future buyer and come back to hurt the company liability wise?

The further back you go, the more absurd it becomes - especially when the website has no such return limit.

You may be right - this may be a poor course of action. I'm willing to try David's solution and see what happens. The worst case scenario is that we end up with more diaper or wipes than we can use and have to give a few away. It's better than nothing.

[Craig Laughlin]

So Target isn't really the problem here. You have a box that originated in their store with no evidence that you came by it legitimately. This is the purpose of receipts! Yet you are hosting a thread tearing the chain down and entertaining thoughts of revenge against them in a more visible manner in your local community? I'm hesitant to pull the WWJD card, but I'll admit to seeing a sense of "standing up for my rights" here that makes me uncomfortable.

OK, 'nuff said. But I couldn't let every comment in the thread fall into the pattern of "rah-rah" for the poor receiptless consumer and "boo" for the evil box store with its heartless policies.

Actually I think the problem is the manager. At least when I was in that position I was empowered to override these restrictions specifically for this reason. When it was obvious to me that the policy was hurting good customers rather than preventing loss, I inserted my key and code and made good folks happy. - I think the manager dropped the ball.

[David Parker]

Actually I think the problem is the manager. At least when I was in that position I was empowered to override these restrictions specifically for this reason. When it was obvious to me that the policy was hurting good customers rather than preventing loss, I inserted my key and code and made good folks happy. - I think the manager dropped the ball.

Amen to that.

In the corporate culture where I was a store manager, the absolute worse thing that could happen was to not properly satisfy a customer and have them go over my head to district supervision or corporate. I once had to drive to a customer's home and deliver a bunch of free merchandise and offer an abject apology because one of my assistant managers (my day off) refused to refund a large meat purchase for some technical reason. Customer called corporate and it all rolled down hill fast. Higher management expects store level management to solve problems at their level. And yes, they will also require shrink performance and inventory control, so there is tension there, but it is the store manager's job to figure it out and perform.

[Craig Laughlin]

Amen to that.

In the corporate culture where I was a store manager, the absolute worse thing that could happen was to not properly satisfy a customer and have them go over my head to district supervision or corporate. I once had to drive to a customer's home and deliver a bunch of free merchandise and offer an abject apology because one of my assistant managers (my day off) refused to refund a large meat purchase for some technical reason. Customer called corporate and it all rolled down hill fast. Higher management expects store level management to solve problems at their level. And yes, they will also require shrink performance and inventory control, so there is tension there, but it is the store manager's job to figure it out and perform.

Yep, this was the case in my environment as well. (Had a friend whose career went south because he caused the exact same thing to happen to our boss) It also brings up another course of action. (I've done this several times) - Go and ask the manager again. If you don't get satisfaction ask for the contact information of the district manager. - Amazing how cooperative some managers become if the other option is giving out the district managers contact info. - Then contact the district manager. Explain who you are, and the situation. Most thieves don't want the scrutiny that comes with going up the latter.

[Dana Grant]

Ok, so I am eager to see how this works out.

[Gina Stevenson]

Too bad that out of two receipts the buyer did not keep at least one of them, too ... if not giving the "gift receipt" that has NO $$$ amount on it to you folks (if gift is kept,then this piece of info need not be known, as givers often prefer). That's the purpose of the gift receipts they regularly give.

Don't recall when anything bought at Target since "when" has not included a usually unnecessary gift receipt. Seems like they just do this as a matter of course if a purchase is not in the use-&-toss category, like soap, TP, food, whatever. Not long ago got a tank top of a color I needed. Unneeded gift receipt accompanied it. So, unless they recently changed again to where one has to now ask ~~ as at some other stores ~~ well, you can pray, too, while waiting to check with mgmt again, that the purchaser may find one of their two receipts.

[Ryan Scott]

We went to a different Target this afternoon and opted for the exchange of baby department items only. Happily, this baby department had a much better selection and we got a monitor, some safety gates and a few bath toys. It worked out in the end, I suppose.

[Dennis M. Scott]

Just a thought. Print out this thread, and send it to corporate. I wonder how they'll feel about this many dissatisfied formerly potential customers. For every one who posted, there are several lurkers like myself.

[Scott Moseley]

Ryan you are very fortunate to live in the USofA where department stores have a return policy. The best I can do here in the PHilippines is 7 days exchange with proof of purchase. Thats it ..thats the best. Money back - NO way. Credit Card - credit back - Nope. No receipt .. you get bewildered and blank stares from the CSRs and managers.

Now in your case it seems Target is being VERY fair and generous. I suggest you take the value of the stroller in something mundane but essential and costly like diapers ( you can never have too many of those) .


Just saw your recent post. Glad everything worked out and you got yourselves a cool monitor.

[Gina Stevenson]

Just a thought. Print out this thread, and send it to corporate. I wonder how they'll feel about this many dissatisfied formerly potential customers. For every one who posted, there are several lurkers like myself.

Good idea, Dennis!

[Steven Burton]

Just a thought. Print out this thread, and send it to corporate. I wonder how they'll feel about this many dissatisfied formerly potential customers. For every one who posted, there are several lurkers like myself.

Just depends on if the people fit into their demographic of customers.