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Thread: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

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    Host Theology Forum Mike Schutz's Avatar

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    Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Several months ago I made the decision to avoid, as much as possible, buying books in favor of ebooks. It was a practical matter. Besides the obvious benefits of cost and convenience, there is for me the practical reality that I simply have no more room. My church office is packed, and since moving into a much smaller home there is little room there.

    Yet there is the frustration when you hear about a book you want, for instance http://www.thehousestudio.com/store/thin-places/, and you see that it is not available as an ebook.

    Have you changed your book-purchasing habits?
    Last edited by Mike Schutz; June 6th, 2012 at 12:36 PM.
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    Senior Member Todd Erickson's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    I can't really stand e-books, for a number of reasons. they take longer to read, they're difficult to lend out, and really, half the reason to owning a book is so that you can lend it to people. That's how I've gone through half a dozen copies of "The Ragamuffin Gospel".
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    Senior Member Ryan Pugh's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Schutz View Post
    Yet there is the frustration when you hear about a book you want, for instance http://www.thehousestudio.com/store/thin-places/, and you see that it is not available as an ebook.
    Hopefully, we can add a "yet" to the end of that sentence.

    Have you changed your book-purchasing habits?
    Kinda, but not really. I don't buy a whole lot of books anyway, even though I read a lot. I either borrow them from a friend (either on kindle or hard copy) or request/have a copy given to me to review.
    Most good things have been said far too many times and just need to be lived. - Shane Claiborne
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    Senior Member Craig Laughlin's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Yep, pretty much all e-books these days. I love it. My ADHD means I often have a hard time reading any one book for long periods of time. It is great to carry one thing with me (Nook in my case) and I can access any book anytime. The down side is that the local Christian bookstore manager attends my church. The new way is about to finish them off.
    Fear not those who argue but those who dodge. -- Marie von Ebner-Eschenbach

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    Host Theology Forum Mike Schutz's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Erickson View Post
    I can't really stand e-books, for a number of reasons. they take longer to read, they're difficult to lend out, and really, half the reason to owning a book is so that you can lend it to people. That's how I've gone through half a dozen copies of "The Ragamuffin Gospel".
    Todd - I cannot count how many copies of Ragamuffin Gospel I've given away. The last two times I've purchased, I've purchased a case.
    "Fully embracing the Gospel, fully engaging the world"
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    Senior Member Billy Cox's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Schutz View Post
    Several months ago I made the decision to avoid, as much as possible, buying books in favor of ebooks. It was a practical matter. Besides the obvious benefits of cost and convenience, there is for me the practical reality that I simply have no more room. My church office is packed, and since moving into a much smaller home there is little room there.

    Yet there is the frustration when you hear about a book you want, for instance http://www.thehousestudio.com/store/thin-places/, and you see that it is not available as an ebook.

    Have you changed your book-purchasing habits?
    My wife and daughter both got Kindle Fire devices for Christmas and I got an iPad2. Since then, I have been reading far more than usual, and all of it has been ebooks. I love the convenience of always having the book(s) I am reading with me.

    The ebook market is still quite new. I expect some major innovations to make ebooks more similar to printed books - such as loaning/gifting a book to someone else, some kind of replacement for those who treat books like trophies to be proudly displayed in more and more bookcases.
    "Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us wthout end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."
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    Senior Member Kyle Borger's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Not into the e-books much yet, but that has more to do with a lack of resources than anything. At the moment all my books are borrowed. But what about Amazon? In addition to e-books they seem to sell everything cheaper than NPH. Often times we find things on NPH and make sure we go buy it on Amazon. While we would like to support our denominational printing company, it simply doesn't make sense to use extra resources to do it.

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    Senior Member Rich Schmidt's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Schutz View Post
    Several months ago I made the decision to avoid, as much as possible, buying books in favor of ebooks. It was a practical matter. Besides the obvious benefits of cost and convenience, there is for me the practical reality that I simply have no more room. My church office is packed, and since moving into a much smaller home there is little room there.

    Yet there is the frustration when you hear about a book you want, for instance http://www.thehousestudio.com/store/thin-places/, and you see that it is not available as an ebook.

    Have you changed your book-purchasing habits?
    Not really. In fact, I don't think I've purchased an ebook yet. I've grabbed plenty of free ones, though. (dccebooks.com has a different book every week.)

    I wasn't about to take my iPad to the pool or beach on our last vacation. But I was happy to grab a few dead-tree books to read out there.
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    Senior Member David Morris's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich Schmidt View Post
    Not really. In fact, I don't think I've purchased an ebook yet. I've grabbed plenty of free ones, though. (dccebooks.com has a different book every week.)

    I wasn't about to take my iPad to the pool or beach on our last vacation. But I was happy to grab a few dead-tree books to read out there.
    I'm with Rich.

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    Senior Member Jeremy D. Scott's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Since I got my iPad, I have mostly bought just ebooks (on Amazon Kindle). I love it. I paid for it in part with print books that I sold in anticipation of getting one. I can certainly say that I'm reading more often. I love the highlighting, sharing, and note-taking functions. In addition, using Amazon instead of iBooks gives me the ability to get a Kindle a bit later (I'm hoping to pick one up soon as they have gotten cheaper...I may yet still wait for the next ones to come out) for things like the beach, on my nightstand, etc. and still have "my" books. Love that it syncs across devices. (I also want a Kindle because some of the free deals aren't available on Kindle for iPad and only are on actual Kindle devices.)

    I get slightly annoyed now when new books aren't available immediately on Kindle. I generally will not buy them unless they are. Just my preference. The only print books I've bought in the last 16 months have been older things that aren't available and likely won't be. One of my favorite books still isn't on Kindle (The Cost of Discipleship). Apparently it will be available in August. I even buy commentaries on Kindle now, which I didn't like to at first, but have gotten used to.

    This has all been part of an assortment of "minimalism" efforts in our lives. Less clutter...again: my preference, not prescriptive for all. :-)
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    Senior Member Cam Pence's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Love e books...I read far more. One exception would be text books, commentaries and the like. Those are still books in which ii prefer to my fingers in the pages and easily flip back and forth between pages, easily make notes and highlights, ect.
    "Love without holiness disintegrates into sentimentality. Personal integrity is lost. But holiness without love is not holiness at all. In spite of its label, it displays harshness, judgmentalism, a critical spirit, and all its capacity for discrimination end in nit-picking and divisiveness."-Mildred Bangs Wynkoop
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    Senior Member Jon Bemis's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Not yet. But I suppose that day's coming. Maybe once I get my first ipad.
    Loving God . . . Loving others.

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    Host Book, Movie & CE forums Ryan Scott's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    For me, it's cost. Unless I have a gift certificate, I rarely pay more than $3 for a book (I love the clearance racks at used book stores).

    I could not get the same titles electronically (if they're even available) for the same price.
    ...just my $.02.
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    Senior Member Rich Schmidt's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Scott View Post
    For me, it's cost. Unless I have a gift certificate, I rarely pay more than $3 for a book (I love the clearance racks at used book stores).

    I could not get the same titles electronically (if they're even available) for the same price.
    Yep, there's no such thing as a "used ebooks rack."

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    Senior Member Wilson Deaton's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    I was on vacation last summer and spent the night in a small town. I decided while there that I wanted to read Ethan Frome by Edith Wharton. That would mean waiting until I was in a town large enough to support a store like Barnes and Noble and hoping they had a copy in stock or waiting until I got home and ordering it. At least that was the way it wouild it have been old school...

    Instead I used my motel's free wi-fi to download her complete works directly to my Nook for $4.79 and began reading the book that evening!

    Yeh, my habits have changed...

    Also, when I buy regular books now, I look for e-book versions first.

    (I do buy souvenir hardcopy books from appropriate locations... Examples: On my recent trip to New England, I purchased a copy of The House of the Seven Gables at the gift shop at the House of the Seven Gables in Salem, MA!)

    Wilson
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    Senior Member Hal Paul's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Everyone in my family has a Nook. I've downloaded most of my books through free sources such as Project Gutenburg, Questia Online Library and Many Books.

    My wife and I share a Barnes & Noble account so we each can access e-books we've purchased our own devices (we just don't want to read them at the same time since the place markers and reading progress save to the cloud). Most newer Barnes and Noble e-books also have a sharing feature that allows me to share books with others. The good thing about this feature is I can set the time that the book is borrowed, when that time expires, I don't have to worry about the borrower forgetting to return it since it is automatically returned to me.

    I manage all my electronic books (over 1400 titles) with Calibre which also allows me to download most of my periodical subscriptions in e-pub format so I can save them directly to my Nook. I'm almost to the point that if a periodical doesn't publish an electronic issue, I won't subscribe.

    The one disadvantage I see is that I may be unaware of what books others in my family have purchased. Recently I bought a book only to find out my son had bought the same title a few days earlier, if it had been a hard copy book I would have seen it and known to not purchase a second copy. But now days, the only hard copy books we buy are color photo intensive, or are more likely to be used for work in the garage.
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    Site Coordinator Hans Deventer's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich Schmidt View Post
    Not really. In fact, I don't think I've purchased an ebook yet. I've grabbed plenty of free ones, though. (dccebooks.com has a different book every week.)

    I wasn't about to take my iPad to the pool or beach on our last vacation. But I was happy to grab a few dead-tree books to read out there.
    Problem with dead trees is that they are too heavy to carry when you're flying. This was my main reason for starting with ebooks.
    "No scripture can mean that God is not love, or that his mercy is not over all his works" (John Wesley - Free Grace, 26)

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    Senior Member Bill Morrison's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Scott View Post
    For me, it's cost. Unless I have a gift certificate, I rarely pay more than $3 for a book (I love the clearance racks at used book stores).

    I could not get the same titles electronically (if they're even available) for the same price.
    I have acquired a large and useful library over the years using your method, in fact the search is for me one of life's little pleasures. At my age (61) it is difficult to change something like this, though I am looking into it. I can see advantages of course, but nothing will ever surpass a hard copy in hand.

    BILL
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    Senior Member Wilson Deaton's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Hans Deventer View Post
    Problem with dead trees is that they are too heavy to carry when you're flying. This was my main reason for starting with ebooks.
    Another problem: My daughter reads more than anyone I know. From the time she was very young, my wife and I often had to get after with what became shortened to us just saying the letters, "T D T R," which she knew meant, "to dark to read." She had to either move to a light source (if available) or quit reading. Now that she's 25, I still tease her and often say, "T D T R" to which she smugly replies, "Backlit!"

    Wilson
    "But by the grace of God I am what I am." (1 Cor. 15:10)
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    Senior Member Rich Schmidt's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Hans Deventer View Post
    Problem with dead trees is that they are too heavy to carry when you're flying. This was my main reason for starting with ebooks.
    That depends on how many books you want to take with you, I guess. Taking 4 books with me was no problem on our vacation last month. They all fit nicely in my carry-on bag, along with a change of clothes, my iPad, etc. I had a dozen or so other books on my iPad, I suppose, but I didn't read any of those. I'm probably not going to read more than 3 or 4 books in a week-long trip, anyway. More than that, and they would have to be ebooks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wilson Deaton View Post
    Another problem: My daughter reads more than anyone I know.
    Which is why I love our public library. Most of the books I read are borrowed.

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    Regular Member Bruce Nuffer's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Schutz View Post
    Several months ago I made the decision to avoid, as much as possible, buying books in favor of ebooks. It was a practical matter. Besides the obvious benefits of cost and convenience, there is for me the practical reality that I simply have no more room. My church office is packed, and since moving into a much smaller home there is little room there.

    Yet there is the frustration when you hear about a book you want, for instance http://www.thehousestudio.com/store/thin-places/, and you see that it is not available as an ebook.

    Have you changed your book-purchasing habits?
    All new titles from Beacon Hill, The House, and Barefoot will be available online. If Thin Places isn't already available on Amazon, it soon will be. Presently for most publishers the print book still leads in the production process, then things are converted for digital. At NPH we are trying to get way from that and conceiving of them both as independent formats needing simultaneous release. However, our workflows haven't changed with the need, and so the ebooks still lag the print release a little. We are closing that gap however.

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    Regular Member Bruce Nuffer's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle Borger View Post
    Not into the e-books much yet, but that has more to do with a lack of resources than anything. At the moment all my books are borrowed. But what about Amazon? In addition to e-books they seem to sell everything cheaper than NPH. Often times we find things on NPH and make sure we go buy it on Amazon. While we would like to support our denominational printing company, it simply doesn't make sense to use extra resources to do it.
    Kyle, I am totally there with you. Big vendors like Wal-Mart, Target, and Amazon frequently buy products at wholesale cost then sell them for below wholesale as loss leaders in order to get people in the stores. Amazon is doing this with eBooks to grow their market share and squeeze out competitors who can't match their loss pricing.

    This was a huge debate when the Left Behind books were selling as new releases in Wal-Mart for less than any bookstore could buy them wholesale. The way our laws are written, in the U.S. a manufacturer can't tell a merchant how much they can or can't sell their product for. The Christian bookstores couldn't match Wal-Mart's loss leader pricing. Best Buy did the same thing with music to the independent music stores, which now no longer exist.

    Since all NPH does is sell content, we can't sell our products at a loss like Amazon. We have no other product we're trying to lure you into buying. The net result is what you are seeing. The long-term implications are sobering for publishers, and lawsuits like the DOJ's suit against Apple is all part of this dilemma.
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    Host Theology Forum Mike Schutz's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Bruce - That continues to be an issue for us end-users who also have influence on the purchases of others. I am pleased with the quality of NPH publications these days, and want to support as much as possible.
    "Fully embracing the Gospel, fully engaging the world"
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  24. #24
    Dan Henderson
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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    My buying habits have changed drastically. I've been eagerly awaiting the total e-text-book era since I watched my daughter put on her first book-backpack and fall backwards, then watched her run to the bus with it bumping the back of her legs. The only book I would buy hard-compy now is one that I would use for frequent referencing. Even that one, I would have in e-form.

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    I am e book exclusive now. I buy some and borrow some through the Kindle lending/overdrive program at our library.

    I specifically enjoy exporting the highlights from my Kindle to Evernote and creating a searchable database of important ideas and information learned from reading.

    I thought I wouldn't like the transition to e books. I love it

  26. #26
    Dan Henderson
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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    I have multiple ebook readers. I prefer the kindle touch over the fire and other backlit screens. THe non-backlit is easier on my tired eyes and can be read in direct sunlight.

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    Senior Member Susan Unger's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Cam Pence View Post
    One exception would be text books, commentaries and the like. Those are still books in which i prefer to my fingers in the pages and easily flip back and forth between pages, easily make notes and highlights, ect.
    This is my reason.
    Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue but with actions and in truth. 1 John 3:18

    There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. 1 John 4:18a


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    Site Coordinator Hans Deventer's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich Schmidt View Post
    That depends on how many books you want to take with you, I guess. Taking 4 books with me was no problem on our vacation last month. They all fit nicely in my carry-on bag, along with a change of clothes, my iPad, etc. I had a dozen or so other books on my iPad, I suppose, but I didn't read any of those. I'm probably not going to read more than 3 or 4 books in a week-long trip, anyway. More than that, and they would have to be ebooks.
    Well, I bought the Kindle when I went to Australia for two week with only carry on luggage. Trust me, it was an issue. And this year, we'll be going for a two week vacation as well, and with Hannie taking her painting gear with her, again, it is definitely an issue.
    "No scripture can mean that God is not love, or that his mercy is not over all his works" (John Wesley - Free Grace, 26)

  29. #29
    Senior Member Rich Schmidt's Avatar

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    Re: Changes in how we purchase books and other resources

    Quote Originally Posted by Hans Deventer View Post
    Well, I bought the Kindle when I went to Australia for two week with only carry on luggage. Trust me, it was an issue. And this year, we'll be going for a two week vacation as well, and with Hannie taking her painting gear with her, again, it is definitely an issue.
    Ah, I see. Only carry-on luggage for a two-week trip? Ebooks-only make perfect sense in that scenario!

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