Baptists drying up?

[John Kennedy]

I frequently watch the on-line Vimeo broadcast (?) of the services of the First Baptist Church in Asheville, NC. The pastor, Guy Sayles, is one of the best preachers I've heard in a long time (and I don't ordinarily enjoy radio/tv preachers).
Anyway, he was baptizing a young girl in the Aug. 5, 2012, service. He was standing in the baptistry and the candidate moved in to stand with him. He then dipped his hand in the water and poured it on her head instead of fully immersing her. The three 'pourings' were in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
Is this a new trend? Has anyone else ever seen this done?

[Gina Stevenson]

Sounds to me like something we have heard of/seen done, in spite of there being a whole pool of water available for dunking, when someone was just too intimidated by the tho't of someone else taking them under the water.

Since that is something they woild not be announcing, probably something to google about, no?

[Larry Parsons]

I frequently watch the on-line Vimeo broadcast (?) of the services of the First Baptist Church in Asheville, NC. The pastor, Guy Sayles, is one of the best preachers I've heard in a long time (and I don't ordinarily enjoy radio/tv preachers).
Anyway, he was baptizing a young girl in the Aug. 5, 2012, service. He was standing in the baptistry and the candidate moved in to stand with him. He then dipped his hand in the water and poured it on her head instead of fully immersing her. The three 'pourings' were in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
Is this a new trend? Has anyone else ever seen this done?

What new about it wasn't this way Jesus was baptize standing in the Jordan and John sprink him and walk out the river without being fully immere. Anyway in our area most of the first baptist churches are not part of the S-Baptist and the First Baptist believe in using women as leaders.
Thanks
Larry

[John Kennedy]

What new about it wasn't this way Jesus was baptize standing in the Jordan and John sprink him and walk out the river without being fully immere. Anyway in our area most of the first baptist churches are not part of the S-Baptist and the First Baptist believe in using women as leaders.
Thanks
Larry

Interestingly enough, Asheville FBC is part of the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship (which maintains a fair distance from the SBC). Several of the associates are women.

The number of men seen when the camera pans the congregation would appear to indicate that there's not a lot of recoil against the 'feminization' of the church.

[John Kennedy]

Sounds to me like something we have heard of/seen done, in spite of there being a whole pool of water available for dunking, when someone was just too intimidated by the tho't of someone else taking them under the water.

Since that is something they woild not be announcing, probably something to google about, no?

That fear of water was what led to my mother being sprinkled by my father at a baptismal service in a Church of Christ (the Nazarene church didn't have a baptistry) when she decided to be rebaptized as an adult (she had been baptized as a baby in the Methodist Episcopal Church, South nearly a half century before). I imagine Barton Stone and the Campbells were whirling madly in their graves when that happened.

[Larry Parsons]

Interestingly enough, Asheville FBC is part of the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship (which maintains a fair distance from the SBC). Several of the associates are women.

The number of men seen when the camera pans the congregation would appear to indicate that there's not a lot of recoil against the 'feminization' of the church.

Right, I couldn't think of Cooperative Baptist Fellowship I have a friend that belong to CBF Baptist church next I see her I will ask her how they are baptise. She is onne of the leaders of the church she is attending. Anyway I think this is interesting.
Thanks
Larry

[John Kennedy]

Right, I couldn't think of Cooperative Baptist Fellowship I have a friend that belong to CBF Baptist church next I see her I will ask her how they are baptise. She is onne of the leaders of the church she is attending. Anyway I think this is interesting.
Thanks
Larry

Well, I've seen the pastor baptize a number of people and this was the only one where a complete immersion didn't take place.

[Gina Stevenson]

Well, I've seen the pastor baptize a number of people and this was the only one where a complete immersion didn't take place.

So, we could nearly deduce that this had to do with water fear, and go beyond that to say, "Lo & behold, more proof that perfection is not instantaneous ... if 'twere, that fear, too, would be 'cast out' (which perfect love does), no?".

[Doug Ward]

I frequently watch the on-line Vimeo broadcast (?) of the services of the First Baptist Church in Asheville, NC. The pastor, Guy Sayles, is one of the best preachers I've heard in a long time (and I don't ordinarily enjoy radio/tv preachers).
Anyway, he was baptizing a young girl in the Aug. 5, 2012, service. He was standing in the baptistry and the candidate moved in to stand with him. He then dipped his hand in the water and poured it on her head instead of fully immersing her. The three 'pourings' were in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
Is this a new trend? Has anyone else ever seen this done?

Wow, one of my old Calvinist professors at Wheaton would be upset. I can hear him now - In Greek, baptizo means to immerse. He is John the immerser, not John the pourer. Do not take this quote as support, it is just commentary.

[Abram Book]

If the candidate was a young girl, she may have had a fear of drowning or a history of ear infections/problems or something that could have been exacerbated by dunking her, so it may not be anything overly theological. In the instances I've seen where baptism has been done by sprinkling or pouring, the pastor usually explains why it is being done that way, however.

[George Wallace]

Wow, one of my old Calvinist professors at Wheaton would be upset. I can hear him now - In Greek, baptizo means to immerse. He is John the immerser, not John the pourer. Do not take this quote as support, it is just commentary.

Don't you mean one of you Baptist professors, that held to a Reformed Ordo Salutis?

Calvin, Knox, Bucer, Cranmer, Bullinger et. al. ...all sprinkle/pourers Immersers weren't really tolerated until the late 1700-early 1800s.

[John Kennedy]

Doug-
Somewhere in the dim, dark past I seem to recall reading that of the twin pillars of Baptist baptismal distinctives (believr's baptism/immersion only) that the 'believer's part was more crucial than the immersion part - that while dunking was strongly preferred, it was of the utmost importance that you not get the baby wet.

[John Kennedy]

Don't you mean one of you Baptist professors, that held to a Reformed Ordo Salutis?

Calvin, Knox, Bucer, Cranmer, Bullinger et. al. ...all sprinkle/pourers Immersers weren't really tolerated until the late 1700-early 1800s.

Brucer and Bullinger I'm not familiar with. The others I recall as thoroughly Reformed. They weren't anabaptist.

[George Wallace]

Brucer and Bullinger I'm not familiar with. The others I recall as thoroughly Reformed. They weren't anabaptist.

Sim..sala Bim

Your wish is my command...

Martin Bucer (early German: Martin Butzer)[1] (11 November 1491 – 28 February 1551) was a Protestant reformer based in Strasbourg who influenced Lutheran, Calvinist, and Anglican doctrines and practices. Bucer was originally a member of the Dominican Order, but after meeting and being influenced by Martin Luther in 1518 he arranged for his monastic vows to be annulled. He then began to work for the Reformation, with the support of Franz von Sickingen.

Bucer's efforts to reform the church in Wissembourg resulted in his excommunication from the Roman Catholic Church, and he was forced to flee to Strasbourg. There he joined a team of reformers which included Matthew Zell, Wolfgang Capito, and Caspar Hedio. He acted as a mediator between the two leading reformers, Martin Luther and Huldrych Zwingli, who differed on the doctrine of the eucharist. Later, Bucer sought agreement on common articles of faith such as the Tetrapolitan Confession and the Wittenberg Concord, working closely with Philipp Melanchthon on the latter.

Bucer believed that the Catholics in the Holy Roman Empire could be convinced to join the Reformation. Through a series of conferences organised by Charles V, he tried to unite Protestants and Catholics to create a German national church separate from Rome. He did not achieve this, as political events led to the Schmalkaldic War and the retreat of Protestantism within the Empire. In 1548, Bucer was persuaded, under duress, to sign the Augsburg Interim, which imposed certain forms of Catholic worship. However, he continued to promote reforms until the city of Strasbourg accepted the Interim, and forced him to leave.

In 1549, Bucer was exiled to England, where, under the guidance of Thomas Cranmer, he was able to influence the second revision of the Book of Common Prayer. He died in Cambridge, England, at the age of 59. Although his ministry did not lead to the formation of a new denomination, many Protestant denominations have claimed him as one of their own. He is remembered as an early pioneer of ecumenism.

Heinrich Bullinger (18 July 1504 – 17 September 1575) was a Swiss reformer, the successor of Huldrych Zwingli as head of the Zurich church and pastor at Grossmünster. A much less controversial figure than John Calvin or Martin Luther, his importance has long been underestimated; recent research shows that he was one of the most influential theologians of the Protestant Reformation in the 16th century.

[Sarah Smith]

A quick check of Baptist history will show that the first one's were not dunked.

The immersion thing came secondary.

Once had a dear lady join a Baptist church "by profession of faith" with nothing more said about baptism, as she had health problems that meant no dunking.